Conquest of the Horde

We can always add the adjustments or cultural additions to lore to the Wiki with a page for each race that lead to the fanon we have made.

Shane Wrote:I think its a good. I don't really think we should just follow Blizzard's lore blindly, there are some things that the CotH can improve whether its orc marriages or something else.

The idea wouldn't be to improve or update lore that Blizz has already given us, it'd be to expand on areas that have been left vague or blank. Unless that's what you meant, in which case I apologize :P

An example would be the death of a Night Elf. I've heard a few people say that Kaldorei plant trees on the graves of the dead. I don't think it's anywhere on wow-wiki (correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't been able to find it), but it's something that makes perfect sense for a night elf to do. That'd be the sort of thing that would fit right in as Fanon.

I like the idea on one condition. GMs have to moderate and have the last word, always!
Just an example was a discussion about magic I had the other day where the other person had a totally different view on magic compared to my own, but we still have the same lore basis.

I'd totally use this to thicken draenei customs, got loads of ideas. Wholly invented ones and some based on ideas and questmentions.

The thread on Warlocks made me think of this idea so I'm going to necrobump it.

I'd like to push to have it implemented at some stage in the future but I want to be sure that there's support for it. I've added a poll to the OP.

And please, don't tl;dr it

I think this is an excellent idea.

Quote:An example would be the death of a Night Elf. I've heard a few people say that Kaldorei plant trees on the graves of the dead. I don't think it's anywhere on wow-wiki (correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't been able to find it), but it's something that makes perfect sense for a night elf to do. That'd be the sort of thing that would fit right in as Fanon.

I thought they turned into whisps.. no clue how I got that idea though.

Any-ho, you got my vote. Good idea.

Edit: And see below, my common sense is off at this hour of the night. /nod

The body doesn't turn into a wisp... Just the spirit. Just because their spirit keeps on living and contributing to Night Elf society doesnt mean they'll just let the person's body rot in the street.

I love this idea so very much.

It's kind of tiring arguing over lore. Taking an approach based on common sense would eliminate many of our contentions over things which aren't mentioned specifically.

I fully support this idea. I've had this problem so many times.

I gotta be honest, I don't like this. Mostly because CoTH is full of "unspoken" rules with Fanon anyhow, like the Warlock stuff I pointed out in my other topic. It leaves little room for adjustment, and people who are used to fudging it, like the majority of roleplayers out there will be lost without having to read up on what is already a monster of information.

Sorry to be blunt, but I think CoTH is already a studious work without having to memorize what the heck you guys have deemed your own canon as well.

Edit: Not to mention, this just -begs- for the already uptight groups of lore hounds to troll profiles and say THATS NOT HOW THINGS WORK HERE. Fuel for the fire, I say.

Edit: Here's another way to explain it. For everything you "can" do on CoTH, there are about five unspoken rules of what you "Can't" do to go with it. The most perfect examples I can come up with are Prestige classes, and the various roll fight systems that people try to implement. Everytime you can do something, it sometimes is accompanied by a crippling stipulation of what you can't do. "If you don't play Vanilla Characters, don't make one at all" seems to be a mantra here. So people that don't know CoTH too well and how to dip around the various rules of "how to RP your character" see this as a chore, rather than fun. If -anything-, this place needs -more- ambiguous lore and -less- rules. Freedom of interpritation? Yes -please-.

DiesUltime Wrote:I gotta be honest, I don't like this. Mostly because CoTH is full of "unspoken" rules with Fanon anyhow, like the Warlock stuff I pointed out in my other topic. It leaves little room for adjustment, and people who are used to fudging it, like the majority of roleplayers out there will be lost without having to read up on what is already a monster of information.

This is true. But wouldn't it be better if these "unspoken" rules were put into some accessible format? It'd help new players understand how things work here. Like how you pointed out in the warlock thread, a lot of people misinterpret distrust of warlocks for them being KoS.

DiesUltime Wrote:Sorry to be blunt, but I think CoTH is already a studious work without having to memorize what the heck you guys have deemed your own canon as well.

True, but the vast majority of Roleplayers love lore. The reason I'd like to see this implemented is because lore is so vague sometimes, if not nonexistent for things that would be common knowledge IC.

DiesUltime Wrote:Edit: Not to mention, this just -begs- for the already uptight groups of lore hounds to troll profiles and say THATS NOT HOW THINGS WORK HERE. Fuel for the fire, I say.

See here's something I have to disagree with. The Fanon idea wouldn't change any canon. If something was up on WoW-wiki it'd be canon, no questions asked. As for the notion of lore hounds 'Trolling', I find it to be a gross misinterpretation. People complain that GMs let a lot of 'dodgy' profiles be approved. Things that are so unique and sueish, they're almost lore-breaking. And yet you're describing people commenting on profiles to attempt to get them to stick to lore better as Trolls. I respectfully disagree.

DiesUltime Wrote:Edit: Here's another way to explain it. For everything you "can" do on CoTH, there are about five unspoken rules of what you "Can't" do to go with it. The most perfect examples I can come up with are Prestige classes, and the various roll fight systems that people try to implement. Everytime you can do something, it sometimes is accompanied by a crippling stipulation of what you can't do. "If you don't play Vanilla Characters, don't make one at all" seems to be a mantra here. So people that don't know CoTH too well and how to dip around the various rules of "how to RP your character" see this as a chore, rather than fun. If -anything-, this place needs -more- ambiguous lore and -less- rules. Freedom of interpritation? Yes -please-.

While I see your point, many people would disagree. While there's nothing wrong with a unique character, a server full of them just leads to headaches. And there's no such thing here or elsewhere as a 'rule' on how to RP your character. There are guides, yes, but that's just what they are. Guides.

You argue for Freedom of Interpretation, and I agree with you there. As an example I'll give Navren and Falathorei. Both did their prestige training by following vastly different interpretations of the same lore. Is there one that's right and one that's wrong? Of course not, they're based off the same lore.

But when you have two different sources of canon which directly contradict one another, it's going to lead to arguments. Let's say one person says that the Order of the Silver hand is still around, which it is according to some canon. So they're on their Silver Hand Paladin, and walk up to an Argent Crusader. According to the crusader, the Silver Hand isn't around anymore, as it completely merged with the Argent Dawn, which according to some canon, it did.

That's two characters who're immediately contradicting one another, lore-wise, even though they've both stuck to the canon they were given. How do they continue their RP? Neither is right, and neither is wrong, but one might wish to talk ICly about working with the Silver Hand, and the other argues OOCly that it's not around anymore.

The idea isn't to create more rules to stick to, but rather to decide which contradictory aspects of lore we want to use here on CotH. And, at the end of the day, it's only Fanon. If someone wants to disagree with Fanon, no-one can stop them.

The people that tend to stick around CoTH are the ones that want to see all this strict change, I've noticed. While you say it's a gross misinterpritation that people here seem to flaunt their knowledge, I think it's more of a gross underestimation of what people actually see when they look at CoTH. There are a lot of arguments on the forums here, more than you'd normally see other places. Lore "discussions" are stifled with "Because I said so" or "The majority does -this-". While yes, carifying a bit more on certain subjects may lead to less arguments, it could also open more floodgates for the people who troll people's profiles and try to "help" by constantly telling a person what they've done wrong.

I honestly think that's something best left up to GMs, but of course the rabble will feel the need to police to gain recognition. It's a rather viscious cycle I've seen here, that to turn one's head and ignore would be rather counter-productive.

Again, I think that outlining things is counter-productive. Allowing the GMs to do their work by correcting profiles is more than enough. It eliminates the players trying to correct players so much.


I think the problems don't lie with the actual lore, but with how profiles are handled on CoTH. It's fine and dandy that a person can lock theirs up, but I think that the workshop should be reserved for advice, and the actual profiles should be restricted to the player who posts, and the GMs who could check it.

Oh please no, I'm not even drunk yet. Five more minutes, then I can deal with this *beep*

Reh. I could see doing this for consistancy again, but I also think the problem is more so people nit-pick stuff to death rather than just letting it go. All works of literature, and roleplay has many, many contradictions. But that's because something that isn't based in reality can never always make sense.

The guy who wrote Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy is quite known for being inconsistant with his own work. However, in mostly every preface for his complete series, he says that it's too much work as well as just maddening to try to fix it. Sure. You could spackle the holes. But when that happens, you start to notice more, and more, and more.


By the time it'd be all said and done, CoTH here would have all it's own lore to fix the lawllore that Blizz has, and then it's just... a monster. You're better off working with what you have, and just approving profiles. Otherwise you are just increasing the workload on -everyone-.