Conquest of the Horde

Hello, ladies and gentlemen.

I apologize for the length of this post, but it has been weighing on my mind, and I felt it would be best to express myself in a way that showed the thought process I used to reach the conclusions I express in it.

I've decided that I have to make a statement about a growing trend that I've noticed recently, much like the discussion I had with many of you at the recent OOC event about the importance of word selection in online communication. I know I'm a new face here, that I haven't been vouched for, and that this may make me unpopular with a certain number of people, but I think it's something that has to be said.

One of the great strengths of an online community is the way it comes together to debate issues, large or small, in a nonpartisan way -- we are anonymous on the internet, and so, unlike in reality, our skin color, wealth, and other biasing factors do not come into play. The written word is one of the only methods of communication that we have without consuming large amounts of bandwidth and time, and so it remains the most viable and most used method of exchanging information over the Internet.

As humanity, on whole, is a species that loves order, this reliance on text has understandably lead us to work towards finding a method to control the chaos that is a rapidly moving discussion. A number of solutions exist: threads on a message board; nested comments; moderation 'bots that control who has the floor; chat channels.

It is the last method that I'd like to discuss here: chat channels. World of Warcraft has a built in system that is meant to regulate your audience, and to steer the discussion in a way that is beneficial to those who share the channel with you -- LocalDefense, for instance, or Trade, have very specific uses.

Here at Conquest of the Horde, we've further specialized, according to the Chat FAQ -- a document we have all sworn to have read when we signed up to play here. LookingForGroup, for instance, is used to find roleplay, or clarify situations. Chat is used have a friendly discussion -- to talk about our day, share a joke, have a detailed discussion on an element of lore, or delve deeper into a roleplaying experience to explore what happened, and why. Barrenschat is a miscellany: the place where Chuck Norris jokes or L337 speak go to die, or where we flee to when we just need to let off some steam with a little repetition (if you catch my drift.)

The problem that I've seen, recently, is that many people seem to disregard, or perhaps be ignorant of, the descriptions that are laid out in the FAQ. The situation has manifested itself in a curious way, though, and one that I had not anticipated: players demand that discussions that are perfectly valid in their current channel, be moved to a channel where they are entirely out of place. Discussions on lore or character armor are told to move to Barrenschat. A talk about someone's day, or about a character's history, are told to move to the forums.

I could understand it if this was only two people bantering back and forth -- a discussion like this would better be suited to party, or whispers. But one where a large portion of the online population has joined in, talking actively about the issue, only be forced to move to an irrational channel? The logic escapes me.

I can understand those of you who complain about a rapidly moving discussion scrolling RP posts off of the screen. It's undeniably a valid concern, but one who's solution lies in your grasp. Don't tell someone to move to an improper channel if you're trying to roleplay, or just because the discussion doesn't interest you: leave the chat channel yourself for a time. You won't be missing out on your RP, and any corrections to the RP shouldn't be happening on the Chat channel anyway.

To those of you who read this, I congratulate you and thank you for your patience. I look forward to your feedback.

I think you've hit the nail on the head here. Thank you for taking the time to write up this post, I'm sure it will help the issue die down a little. I believe you are absolutely right when you said that those who are not interested in the Chat going on in the Chat Channel should leave.

I also feel that many more should read this post and if they are still unaware of the Channel's purposes, read the FAQ's or ask someone who knows a bit more about them.

Thanks, rentreality!

Firstly, I'd like to say that it's not the vouches that make the player, it's posts like these. This is a well thought-out and argued post that I do agree with. It seems, the opinions of how the chat channels work are warped as time goes by.

As for my own opinions, well, I do believe that there is a problem here, but I have no idea how to fix it.

I agree with this completely.

Just throwin' this out there for all you people who can't stand having other people's chat conversations interupt your RP, try separating your RP and global chat channels into different chat windows. I believe Aeonar wrote a guide on how to do it some time ago.

Also: You can change the color of the Chat Channel, to make things easier to filter out.

Yar, and on top of that, you can actually create a different chat window, one that includes channels, and one that only includes Rp specific things like /say. Mess around with Blizzard's chat options, and you will find there is quite a lot you can do that goes towards organizing your channels.

Yeah, that's what Aeonar's guide teaches you how to do.

This is off-topic but, whatever happened to good ol' Aeonar?

((Aeonar left for his own reasons and may or may not return. Most likely not.))

The reason why a lot of chat conversations are sent off into the outer-world known as barrenschat is because of the length. Yes, topics of lore or discussions about characters and the like are very right to be in chat, but after so long it does get over-powering of RP. Many people have made separate windows for this reason, but the fact is, is that if it is getting either, too heated or too long people will no matter what, ask you to either move it to private chat (If there is only two people discussing) or to move it to Barrens.

It isn't that you weren't using the channel for the wrong reasons, it is that long discussions of lore/charcters/blah blah blah can often interrupt small talk needed to clarify things happening in RP that can not be discussed in LFG.

Plus, usually when people ask you to do something nicely, people usually do it. /shrug I've been here longer than most and I respect the whole, "Please move this lengthy chat to Barrens/private/yourownchannel."

( I feel so... Remembered. 8D )

I can't relate too well to this issue, as this wasn't much of an issue when I was on CotH. If the GMs said to move a conversation, it got moved. Granted, some conversations really shouldn't need to be moved, but that's beside the point.

As Shivali said before, yeah, I made a handy little guide on splitting your chat channels. (I lack the link at the moment, I hope it's still in the Guides section of the forums.) If all else fails, make your own channel! Easy as pie. Type /join <Channel Name> to make a channel, then other people can join too. Great for discussions that have more interested parties than would fit in a party chat. Though, do remember, a GM's word is law.

( *Waves to everyone* Hai guys! Shame to hear about some of the GMs leaving, but congratulations to Kagh and Nari, two very well-deserved GM-ships. )

I appreciate the feedback I've seen in this thread. I feel I must clarify one element: in no way did I mean to suggest that, should a GM request you move the conversation, you refuse. That would be silly. I also did not mean to suggest that you not comply with another player's request to move. It's a matter of manners.

I do feel that I need to respond to a few points you brought up, though, Cressy.

Cressy Wrote:The reason why a lot of chat conversations are sent off into the outer-world known as barrenschat is because of the length. Yes, topics of lore or discussions about characters and the like are very right to be in chat, but after so long it does get over-powering of RP. Many people have made separate windows for this reason, but the fact is, is that if it is getting either, too heated or too long people will no matter what, ask you to either move it to private chat (If there is only two people discussing) or to move it to Barrens.

This seems counter-intuitive. The entire purpose of the chat channel is to provide an arena for multi-partner debate, and a single individual -- unless empowered as a moderator, such as a GM -- should not hold the power to shut it down. It is bad manners to suggest otherwise.

I can understand the concern that a rapidly-moving, active debate might overwhelm RP, and I thought I -- and others who replied to this topic -- addressed that earlier. If the debate does not interest you or is interfering, it is infinitely more polite for you to leave the chat than it is to request the chat cease, or move to an incorrect channel where not only is it out of place, but is more likely to encounter interruption.

Cressy Wrote:It isn't that you weren't using the channel for the wrong reasons, it is that long discussions of lore/charcters/blah blah blah can often interrupt small talk needed to clarify things happening in RP that can not be discussed in LFG.

I was under the impression, from the Chat FAQ and the threads referred to in it, that the LFG channel was the place for all RP clarifications. If they are too long or detailed for the LFG channel, it might be better to discuss them with each other in party or custom channel setting, as roleplay is not only in many cases a relatively private affair, but is also in most cases constrained between two or three people, as opposed to a majority of the server.

Cressy Wrote:Plus, usually when people ask you to do something nicely, people usually do it. /shrug I've been here longer than most and I respect the whole, "Please move this lengthy chat to Barrens/private/yourownchannel."

Absolutely, yes. It is good manners to comply with such a request.

If I might just toss a few cents in here, I wanted to add this. Isn't it much easier for one person to leave chat until things calm down, than it would be for many people to up and move somewhere else? I know not everyone uses barrens so some would have to join it or a party. Plus the conversation going on would lose track in the move, disrupting everything. And if your in the middle of a session that requires quite a lot of your screen space to be free for incoming posts wouldn't it be wiser to not be in chat? I know when I'm in a really good RP and then someone joins there can be a jump in chat with all the greetings and such. So instead of asking them to move, I usually leave and return when I'm done. Hope I don't get in trouble for this, just my opinion.

The reason conversations that get very lengthy are often asked either to be taken to the forums, or to be taken private, or even to barrens, is because of one, simple reason. While it may be a very intellectual and serious discussion, it stretches things out in the chat channel, and interupts RP. While you may see it as rude, or intrusive for people to ask you to move channels, to them, it's just as rude for you to argue a reasonable request when their RP is being spammed out due to a long discussion about whatever.

The forums enable you to take such a conversation here, and also allows for deeper, longer thought out input rather than the on the fly answering in game discussion spurs on.

Now, if someone is being blatantly rude about it, that is -another- story. People should be asking nicely, and not "bitching" people out if such a conversation is spurred on. We -encourage- deep thought, and questions. However, again, we've tried to designate a spot for it, rightfully. And that would be the forums.


I hope that sheds a little light onto what at least one of the GMs think, and possibly give insight to our reasoning for making it that way.

Rensin Wrote:The reason conversations that get very lengthy are often asked either to be taken to the forums, or to be taken private, or even to barrens, is because of one, simple reason. While it may be a very intellectual and serious discussion, it stretches things out in the chat channel, and interupts RP. While you may see it as rude, or intrusive for people to ask you to move channels, to them, it's just as rude for you to argue a reasonable request when their RP is being spammed out due to a long discussion about whatever.

I believed that a situation like that had already been responded to, several times, in the posts above: it is infinitely more polite for a person who is having a hard time keeping up with the chat channel and RP to leave the channel, or separate their chat windows to create a Chat window, and an RP window, as I have set up on my own computer.

Given that they could quite simply and politely solve the situation for themselves, in a way that would only affect themselves, as opposed to rudely asking a discussion to move, I can't help but think it's not a reasonable request. Before I separated my chat windows, I simply left chat if it was interrupting my work. Corrections to an ongoing RP shouldn't be happening in Chat anyway, so a roleplayer should remain largely unaffected by it.