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I need an honest discussion.
#1
Okay.

This is reallyfreakin'long. I apologize for this. But before I post Elidyn's character profile, I have some non-player-or-character-specific OOC issues I need to work out, and I really need feedback, updated information, opinions...

I've done an awful lot of reading around the site- particularly the stuff from about a year ago. It seems that there were a series of OOC conflicts, and one of them focused on 'characters being too nice/accepting in regards to race.' I don't know what the verdict was on this- if middle ground was found in the end. But I'd like to say that racism is a real life issue that greatly saddens and infuriates me by turns. As a roleplayer, I particularly love the 'World' aspect of 'World of Warcraft.' I love the diversity and variety of characters and personalities, and the unique ways in which players interpret situations. A certain amount of racism is important in such a setting, as well as characters knowing their limits. (No BElfs in Ironforge, check!) But reading the stuff about 'give hate a chance' really upset me, I won't lie. If I want a wildly intolerant, racist, hateful world, all I have to do is look at a map of the Earth.

Roleplay is supposed to allow you to step into a different setting, wearing someone else's skin, and enjoy interactions beyond the norm. I don't understand the motivation behind donning pointy ears of varying shades just to chill with other folks who look, act, and have worldviews just like mine, dressed up with different turns of phrase. It's depressing... because I can do that in reality, sans eartips. So when having an openminded character could invite scornful OOC criticism from other players, I get intimidated. I honestly don't know why, but playing a murdering character isn't nearly as upsetting to me as a discriminatory one. Maybe because I don't deal with the bloody and horrifying results of murder every day, but frustration and inequality are things tackled often.

What's relaxing, fun, or enjoyable about having a bad taste in your mouth each time you log off?

So, my point is this. Elidyn does not hate because she is told to hate. Wariness and fairly obvious fear of the unknown? Yes! Outright scorn and biting remarks to strangers? Not so much. It is most likely my 'weakness as a roleplayer' that has caused this to come about. Bein' human does that to you. As a person, I have limits to what I can and can't portray... and we're told not to associate too closely with our characters. I think that's very wise, but I also think that too much disassociation takes away from the 'reality' of your character. I don't think of my character's insults like they are coming from me, nor do I take offense at the incoming ones. However, I am an empathetic person. I sympathize with people in their situations.

If that makes me 'too soft' or 'too attached,' then I'll try to back out now with as much grace as I can muster.
-proxeh-proxxi-pr0xx0rz-proxxanne-pro.x.x.x.-proxay-prawckzi-pr0kkles-proxxaganda-pr0kzimity-
[Verdantine] says: I've found eating things given to you by strange elves can lead to magical adventure and the loss of limbs!
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#2
Hehe, well, I certainly hope we don't open up yet another one of these discussions again for too long. XD

The bottom line is no one is going to force you to Rp in a style which makes you uncomfortable or leaves you with a bad taste, nor are you going to suffer horrible OOC comments behind your back, in your face, etc. And I believe the people we have on this server are above that. -However- what you will get is the possibility of a lot of IC hate directed towards your character by other members of your race. For example: If you're a Blood Elf, and you befriend a Night Elf, there is a huge chance that other Blood Elves would despise you, perhaps even to the point where you are considered a traitor. However, that is a rather extreme example. In truth what we aim for is realism in our characters, and strive to have them act as one of their race should act when faced with certain situations.

That being said yes there are occasionally people who break from the norm, but when this happens too often it becomes a complete reality crusher for the other RPers. A good example for this is Gricca, she alone manages to pull off a rather excellent job of playing a neutral Forsaken, and thus has drawn the ire of one of my own Forsaken who does not seem to agree with her thoughts on life, etc. What Gricca has done is awesome, and in fact fosters RP. The problem that arises is when all of a sudden every single Forsaken is a 'Gricca' at which point they aren't really representing the Forsaken properly in the game world, as people like Gricca are somewhat of a rarity among their kind.

Since from your guild I assume you're referring to a Blood Elf, you do not need to be arrogant, or to hate on every person you see, but remember that IC actions = IC consequences, and other Blood Elves -might- have a problem with your characters attitude. Of course in the end IC and OOC shouldn't mix. There is a difference between hating a character and hating the person behind the character. Overall I don't think you have anything to worry about, unless you go and completely break some pivotal lore piece that everyone has a problem with. (BE + NE = Not a good mix!)

Though another really good point to bring up is that you must justify with your character profile why your character may not hate something that they would normally hate. I hate to keep using the Blood Elves as an example, but they make a good one. Blood Elves -hate- the Night Elves with a passion, and vice versa, because they were banished from their own lands by the Night Elves. They have every reason to hate them, and it makes sense that they would. But in the end, if that sort of RP makes you uncomfortable, then RP what you want to RP, and don't feel constrained to fitting your race's mindset to the letter.

((It's late, hopefully all that jumbled together makes sense, if not too bad, because I'm Zzzzzing. :3))
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#3
My point of view is...

Like in real world, in WoW there are conflicts. We just need to read some lore to find it out. Let's look at the case of the blood elves, for example.

They were part of the Alliance. Although they accepted help from the naga because they needed, the Alliance sees this as a betrayal. And, obviously, the Horde sees them as former part of the Alliance. To make things worse, they are addicted to magic and we just need to take a look at king Varian's comic to know what happens to a blood elf an contact of a little fel magic. With that settled, we can see that blood elves have at least a direct mistrust from everyone in general and blood elf warlocks are the culmination of all the things everyone in Azeroth hates.

With that settled, let's move to more particular issues.

In the real world, not everyone hates black people, white people, jews or even nazi people. Nothing stops you from creating a character that is friendly towards most races. I play (or used to play, because I'm still thinking if I leave or not the server) an orc that is "friendly" towards everyone, both Horde and Alliance because he used to be a wandering healer. Of course your reason can be different than mine.

Now to OOC issues, if you play a human and I play a troll, if I look you in the eyes and say "Be gun', pink trash!", that doesn't mean you can't /w me to invite me to help you in whatever, tell me the joke of the day or just to become friends, right? Just because your character's father murdered character's brother and raped his sister, doesn't mean I have to find out where you live and kill you with a shotgun. People should let IC issues remain IC issues but NOT turn them OOC issues.

I hope I could answer what you needed. :D
Freedom is only an allucination. - Anathema
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#4
Thank you!

That was what I was looking for.

IC hate is a non-issue, and I fully intend to back everything up. I just didn't want to get in trouble for not adhering strictly to the rulesheet.

Confidence restored.

/reassured.
-proxeh-proxxi-pr0xx0rz-proxxanne-pro.x.x.x.-proxay-prawckzi-pr0kkles-proxxaganda-pr0kzimity-
[Verdantine] says: I've found eating things given to you by strange elves can lead to magical adventure and the loss of limbs!
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#5
I think the problem arises from the "War" part of "World of Warcraft".

The entire series is focused around war, every book, game, spinoff and card game also being focused with war as its central point. All the normal and even not-so-normal people inside this world are affected in at least one way by the war.

For example, Orcs have been at war with humans since they arrived on the planet, save for a very brief ceasefire.

Due to the world being centered around the premise of encroaching forces at every turn (Murlocs, Defias, Gnolls, over-aggressive wolves and bears and Kobolds are just the threats of -one- town, Goldshire), people in this world have developed a xenophobic nature (not all, most). It's like in real life, say Germany is at war with... Austria. When at war, they wouldn't like eachother at all, would they?

And on to my second point... Racism within the Alliance.

The Elves distrust most of the other races because... Well, a superiority complex (from being so old and wise).
Humans distrust quite a few other races because they believe themselves the most intelligent, and the most deserving of the land.

Draenei, Gnomes and Dwarves don't really have qualms with the other races.

But, re-reading your post... Yes, i completely agree with you. I don't see why everyone has to hate everyone, because, drawing from reality once more, even though half the world is at war with the other half of the world, we still have the courtesy to say "Hi" to a person of a nation we are at war/not-so-good relations with. Relations in the World of Warcraft should be the same, wary but cordial at worst... I will edit my post if i want to add a point...

EDIT:
Quote:In the real world, not everyone hates black people, white people, jews or even nazi people. Nothing stops you from creating a character that is friendly towards most races. I play (or used to play, because I'm still thinking if I leave or not the server) an orc that is "friendly" towards everyone, both Horde and Alliance because he used to be a wandering healer. Of course your reason can be different than mine.

Gah! My point!




Move him into the sun—
Gently its touch awoke him once,
At home, whispering of fields half-sown.
Always it woke him, even in France,
Until this morning and this snow.
If anything might rouse him now
The kind old sun will know.

Think how it wakes the seeds,—
Woke, once, the clays of a cold star.
Are limbs, so dear-achieved, are sides,
Full-nerved—still warm—too hard to stir?
Was it for this the clay grew tall?
—O what made fatuous sunbeams toil
To break earth’s sleep at all?
[Image: 62675bf4fd.jpg] [Image: 0e7357dcfe.jpg]
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#6
Believe me I've been in your situation before Proxy, ironic because I am one of the most agitated people when it comes to watching inter-faction befriending. (I once had a Nelf that was so tolerant of the other races that her best friend was a Troll, she dated...A female Nelf, a female Belf...And! A human man. I am really surprised someone didn't shoot me in the face with a fail gun back when I started.)

I know there are always going to be a chosen few in the hypothetical world that are like your character, but when everyone chooses to play the exception, it tends to remove the War and a realism from it as well.

As Vrahn said, remember IC actions can cause IC consequences. Already I have seen someone on this server had reputation -docked- because someone reported them to authorities for befriending an opposing faction member. (A night elf to a blood elf just for clarification.)

I have just woken up while writing this post so it might not be the most clear, but the main point that I want to get across is that...

1. Racism in wow still is the norm. Check in to your races information a little more indepth to see how they really think about the other races.
2. Just because your character isn't a racist, doesn't mean mine won't be! (They all are. Even one hates her own kind.)
and lastly!
3. Everyone wants to be the exception, but if everyone -is- that exception, then who is the norm?

I think I am done. . . I might have to come back to edit it when I am more alive.
[Image: anigif_mobile_9893b2566588ab845c7985f71769a9f2-7.gif]
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#7
Those were also written at a time when everyone was able to get reputation with enemy cities and the sheer amount of people being 100% (or 80%) accepting of these enemy races coming in. A lot of people were actually OOC offended when there was a crackdown on BE and Undead hanging around Goldshire and they formed an IC group to rebel against it. Crazy AND interesting.

It was also the summer of a whole lot of interracial eRP, roflmao.

So it wasn't written out to control individual characters, but douse a, uh, growing phenomena.
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