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IC PVP?
#1
I have been thinking about the combat on the server. The roll system works well but it gets real messy with more than two people. I have been trying to think of a better way. There is not much to work with. One of the other methods it strait PVP fighting using what blizzard gave us, but the problem with that way is that it is gear and level based. But what if it did not have to be?

What I am asking is I wonder if there is some way to set every ones attributes points to the same. Or perhaps a ring or trinket that dose it? Well the same for each class, you wouldn't have to figure out the balance, I would use whatever the latest gladiator set makes them. So when you ware the ring (or what ever) it dose not matter what gear (or weapon) you have on every ones stats are the same for their class. Is this even possible? And would people like it? I know it is not just a snap of the fingers thing and would take work; I am just making a suggestion here.

If this did work I think it would be a great benefit to the in character feel of the server. We could actually go out and do more things and not spend hrs standing and talking. If it did work I think every one should get one, even though it would make it easier for peons to level,(this server is about RP not leveling) they still could not go beyond 50 or get silver tokens till they are a grunt. Also, if it work and GM agreed to it, we might have to reevaluate IC deaths but maybe not, if we were all a high stats it would be hard to kill one another. I could see this being a lot of fun and solving our IC combat problem.

I would love to hear your thoughts on the subject.
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#2
Hehe this looks GREAT! Imo :P

But problem is alot of people will start ganking without permission etc and all because of a new IC PvP system :P

Very possible system! but it will come wtih it's downfalls and idiotic children using it as an excuse to gank lower levels.

Not only that, but you got a bit more imagination when doing RP battles, knowing exactly what you're doing, not doing a load of crap that your character can't even do IC'ly
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#3
Being nothing short of a PVP-fiend myself; there is nothing that I love more than a game with good PVP.
Unfortunately, however; I've always found WoW's PVP to be inherently broken, due to the sole fact that no matter how skilled a player is; you're ultimately as good as your gear and epic loot. Which, makes WoW a really lousy PVP game in that regard.

A few things have been settled with the PVP system though; but on a roleplay server - no algorithms or amount of server-processed numbers will ever surpass a beautifully written battle. I realize fights do get convoluted when you have more than two people in a single fight, however.

It is a good idea on paper, DuskWolf; unfortunately the game's design is so diluted regarding PVP, that it'll always be gimped in one fashion or another - since every class has their own preset stat table, even when all gear is removed; your race, class, nostril size, blood type, and personal preference of artificial fruit flavoring always determine your root numerics; so having a truly equal fight will never exist in this game.

If all parties are consentual though; there's nothing stopping people from using the perma-flag feature, or Gurubashi arena if you want to throw down a fellow Alliance/Hordie.
[corners=forumbg forumbg-table][table=tablebg table1][thead][tr=0][th=4]Character Information[/th][/tr][/thead][tbody][tr=bg1][td=1,]Name[/td][td=1,]Affiliation[/td][td=1,]Status[/td][td=1,]Title[/td][/tr]
[tr=bg2][td=1,]Ivy Killinger[/td][td=1,]The Lodestone Company[/td][td=1,]Inebriated[/td][td=1,]Drunken Fightin' Wench[/td][/tr]
[tr=bg2][td=1,]Uulari[/td][td=1,][/td][td=1,]Alive[/td][td=1,]Seer[/td][/tr]
[tr=bg2][td=1,]Vyrsallia Scythefall[/td][td=1,][/td][td=1,]Alive[/td][td=1,]Guttersnipe and Ne'erdowell[/td][/tr][/tbody][/table][/corners]
[Image: badge.jpg]
I'm a Shaman? Really? Huh.
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#4
A few things.

One, this idea isn't half bad. And trinkets were actually made before the server updated to WoTLK. Not sure if Kretol is going to create them or not, seeing as the server isn't quite stable yet.

And even if people aren't keen on PvP, they can still get a better chance at leveling. So in theory it's a win-win situation.

But I can already see a couple of problems.

1) In the event a gnome and a tauren fight, and the gnome is better at PvP, there is already issues. A.K.A, it's very unlikely a gnome would take down a tauren.

2) There are always a few characters that are, maybe not superior than them, but probably better in their particular field. For example, my troll (Mokaku) used to be a captain of a pirate ship, and he more often than not, got into quite a few brawls. Now obviously, he's had better experience of drunken/sober, fist to fist brawls than say, a noble knight from Stormwind.

If the players can resolve those issues, then I don't see this being a bad thing. However in the end it's down to Kretol, seeing as he's the one who's making these items. ^^
"I am more afraid of one hundred sheep led by a lion than one hundred lions led by a sheep."
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#5
I understand completely why you would want to use PVP to solve certain fights that involve a lot of people. My main problem with it besides what some of the others have pointed out is that you cannot really work using the environment into a fight, and also certain spells such as a fireball for example should pretty much outright screw you over, but your character can simply shrug them off using the mechanics of WoW, heck, even decapitation isn't lethal according to WoW mechanics.
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#6
Plus the level differance, grunt's wouldn't be able to fight peon's fairly, nor the other way around. Plus the gear people choose, Rexx has awesome gear, yet my human warrior Tristan has like, the durable set, which sucks.
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#7
I've seen this being done for both amazingly huge, and rather small, battles back at retail, where it was necessary due to the lack of cross-faction custom emotes and communication. I found that it worked quite well, provided people still applied IC tactics, thinking, and wore sensible gear of similar quality.

The biggest problem by far was that, at those occasions where 50+ people attended on each side, it'd eventually attract people that had other things than Roleplaying in mind - There was a few episodes when the major PvP Guilds would suddently come streaming down from Ironforge and quite effectively win us the battle with a minimum of fuss, and no IC interaction whatsoever.
The situation at CotH seems to be a bit different, in that we both have far smoother means of communication, and we're so limited in numbers that we don't really get the same chaos that you often did at retail - That means we can pull off the realism that was simply not available at the official servers trough emotes, and occasionally rolling as a way of settling for a result.

What seems to be the biggest problem with the large-scale emote battles here, is that people invariably end up waiting for ten minutes between each emote, and it all ends up in a battle of dice with lots of added chaos, rather than an enjoyable RP Session. In the end, we just get a lot of frustrated people that's spent two hours to see their character getting killed off by some random numbers, instead of proper roleplay. This is because, when you're in large groups, the battle needs to flow so quickly that people won't go bored and leave - As a result, it's reduced to a pure battle of the dice, where Class, Character and Creativity only serve to spice up the mandatory "Bob hits Joe"-emote after each roll, but has little or no effect on how the battle actually plays out. I simply don't think that the Rolling System works for large groups.

What I've usually ended up getting mixed into, is splitting off from the main group, into a smaller side-fight made up of 2-4/5 people. This has two advantages, the first being that the waiting-time is vastly shortened down. Secondly, the smaller amount of people means that people are more inclined to sit down and discuss how things should be/can be done, rather than pressing for people to finish their turn quickly so that they can do their own rolls. That way, people get to be creative and don't feel that they have to slavishly follow a rather limiting ruleset all the time because there's ten people waiting for you to wrap up, and they all feel they're wasting their time.

Trying to steer myself back on topic, it just seems to me that the "Real" PvP (while probhably doable, with some rules for gear and such,) wouldn't be necessary if we split up our battles from the start - From my experience, the small groups get to settle for roll-modifiers due to equipment and skills, interesting spells and tactics, and generally have a much more friendly and less stressful atmosphere than the big group. And, even with all that, they still only have to wait for a fraction of the time that people has to in the bigger groups!

This might not be new knowledge to many, it might be long, and it might just be mindless ramlbing - But there, I wrote it anyways!
Hogral Coalbeard - Impulsive Explorer
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#8
Just to make it clear what I was asking was if there was a way to make it so you could ware what ever armor you wanted have what ever weapon and no mater your level, every ones stats would be the same. So we could could do normal game pvp with out having it be gear and level dependent.
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#9
I think this is a great idea! I see everyone's concerns about it and would like to just expand on the few that are my own as well.

Personally, I am HORRID at PvP. Really. I can make people cry just watching how bad I am. But, one of my characters is supposed to be somewhat clever at getting herself out of risky situations. I can not accomplish half of what I'd like to with an actual dual as I can with writing. Also, I'll agree that the game mechanics are somewhat unrealistic. There is no way an Orc could hack away at poor Ophelia with his axe, only for her to turn the tides and win due to stuns. She would have probably succumbed after his first attack!

But, perhaps we can find a place in the middle.

When I roleplay out a fight scene with the opposite faction, I enjoy having the PVP Flags up so I can use my skills on them. Now, I don't actually pay attention to any damage done by it, I just enjoy doing this for the effect. For example: Shadowstep. I will write an emote for it and then use the skill for a dramatic effect. Depending on the other's reaction, she can miss her strike afterwards, or land upside down. There are other abilitities like this that can be used in the same manner. Perhaps there could be a Free-For-All combat system? That would allow for the dramatic effect to be used.

D'oh! This still doesn't solve the chaos problem though. Sorry. :(
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Katharina Dawnrunner - Sin'dorei Fire Dancer
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Ael'iana Silversun - Feminist Blood Knight
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