Tanaris humans?

[anji]

Anyone who has quested in Tanaris will be familiar with the Wastewander bandits. From what I can gather from the game and WoWwiki, they are rugged nomads, they don't get along with the Steamwheedle Cartel, and they're led by one "Caliph Scorpidsting".

I knew a few people who played 'Tanari' characters on live servers, and they were largely modelled on bedouins. Without a doubt it was a stretch to play arab-esque nomads in Azeroth, but the players I speak of did a great job role-playing these characters. Few players objected to their characters, but of course live players are less strict about lore than we are.

What I would like to know is: how do we define the wastewanders? Are they:

-Human bandits who wandered to Tanaris in recent years, after Kalimdor was rediscovered?
-A culture of human nomads that has existed in Tanaris for many years?
-Or is 'Caliph Scorpidsting' another idiosyncrasy from Blizzard, and are the Wastewanders something we should disregard altogether?

So far the only information I've found on the Wastewanders is a short WoWpedia article, so I would greatly appreciate everyone else's thoughts.

[flammos200]

The first Humans landed on Kalimdor during the Third War, namely the Human Survivors of Lordaeron, who founded Theramore. This is Lore-fact. No Humans existed on Kalimdor prior to that(With the exception of Rhonin briefly during the Sundering, because he time-traveled).

The Wastewanders are a group of bandits established after the Third War. That's it.

And Wastewanders having existed in Tanaris previous to the Third War has been shot down by the GMs before. Which is why you don't see them around right now.

[anji]

I wasn't sure if the topic had been addressed before. I should have figured that humans couldn't have been in Kalimdor before the Third War. Thank you for clarifying!

[Sol]

Don't be so hasty. I've found no compelling evidence to completely discount the suggestion that the Wastewanders lived on Kalimdor prior to the Third War and a fair bit to potentially support it. Kalimdor, after all, was originally one continent, and it seems that humanity was as widely spread across it as the trolls were. The title 'Caliph' among other things suggests, if nothing else, some form of independent culture, and further hints at as much are introduced in Uldum come Cataclysm.

Moreover, assuming the Wastewander Nomads/Bandits are, in fact, new arrivals . . . why on Azeroth would they, by choice, persist in one of Azeroth's most inhospitable climes, fighting tooth and nail with goblins, trolls and silithid for even water to drink with no profit to be made? If that's the case, they aren't smart bandits. The Wastewanders being indigenous nomads would neatly sidestep this obvious issue of logic. (The abundance of what appear, due to the size of the cranium and the lack of tusks, to be human skulls in Zul'Farrak is another factor that may be worth consideration.)

I understand that the lore here is precarious and inconclusive, but given the several human characters utilising this origin on the server that have been approved and played for several months, I think the possibility should remain open. However, assigning them a sophisticated bedouin-esque culture is outright fanon and should be regarded carefully.

[flammos200]

A similar case can be made for Eastern Kingdoms Night Elves. We know that Pre-Sundering, the Night Elves inhabited all of Kalimdor(Kalimdor of today + half of Northrend + The Eastern Kingdoms + Zin'Azshari), with only the Aquir at the North and South and the Dragons to give them pause.

There is no Lore to support Night Elves not existing after the Sundering on the Eastern Kingdoms, since half a continent is a big place to be, and the Kaldorei Empire was huge. Plus, there are moonwells on the EK and Emerald Trees, who would theoretically be guarded by Night Elves(since there are NElven Ruins around them). So, why don't we play 'em? Because there's not enough Lore to support it.

several human characters utilising this origin on the server that have been approved

Name three. Or two.

[Caravan]

Name three. Or two.

Edit: I swear, this editor will be the death of me.

http://wiki.conquestofthehorde.com/Orthander
http://wiki.conquestofthehorde.com/Tarai

Should I ever profile Ashaila, she's a Tanaris-origined human. Bekkari was a practicing Tanari (NOT Wastewander)

[muhaha8]

I think the decision was made a while ago, though, that there were to be no more new Tanari folk, though the people who had them could continue to play them, so...

[McKnighter]

Didn't the Cult of the Damned have Night elves in their ranks before/during the Third War? Or are those Quel'dorei? Blizzard is pretty lazy about their models.

[muhaha8]

Didn't the Cult of the Damned have Night elves in their ranks? Or are those Quel'dorei? Blizzard is pretty lazy about their models.

It's believed that there's possibly every race in its ranks.

[flammos200]

I think the decision was made a while ago, though, that there were to be no more new Tanari folk, though the people who had them could continue to play them, so...

Yeah. Happened around the time Sunday wanted to make a guild centered around 'em, from what I remember.

[McKnighter]

Well, I mean, before/during Third War. (Should've clarified. Sorry!)

[flammos200]

Well, I mean, before/during Third War. (Should've clarified. Sorry!)

Due to the fact that the Cult of the Damned makes all potential members drink a potion that ensures their loyalty and binds them mentally to the will of the Lich King forever, it is quite possible an unwary NElf might get tricked into it, if they'd been warily lost on a continent, cut off from home for aeons.

But back to "Tanari" humans. What's the GM verdict on this one?

[Piroska]

The first Humans landed on Kalimdor during the Third War, namely the Human Survivors of Lordaeron, who founded Theramore. This is Lore-fact. No Humans existed on Kalimdor prior to that(With the exception of Rhonin briefly during the Sundering, because he time-traveled).

I've always been a little wary of these sorts of statements. For one, there are full adult half-human, half-night elf characters in the lore. Feulia comes to mind. For two, logically speaking, I cannot believe that no one ever thought to set sail over the horizon to see what was there. There are a number of fairly well-developed seafaring civilizations, many of whom would potentially wish to travel the world. Whether they would do it for the need to explore, looking for resources to accumulate more gold, or for some other reason, I don't know. However, I cannot and will not believe that no human ever traversed the sea.

Hell, a human could have been a crewmember (willing or otherwise) of a goblin vessel or a stowaway. I'm fairly certain that goblins would have at least made an effort to determine what resources resided in Kalimdor so that they could turn a profit.

Given that the Wastewander bandits haven't had an origin explained, it's just as plausible that an early expedition somehow made it to Kalimdor and either chose to live there or was forced to do so after a particularly nasty shipwreck. There are humans in Uldum as well, which the Shnottz troops claimed were there before even they were. To quote Martin Rees, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

I am not saying that this idea should be embraced without thought. I think, however, this may be a situation where a little bit of logic can be aptly applied.

[Rigley]

Word of Grak has stated in the past that we don't wish to delve into this-- most ideas on the subject are speculation and aren't heavily grounded in lore, and we don't feel comfortable with using extensive fanon. There is a lot assumed out of their culture from the fact that they have a leader named caliph, and past that their history is still a bit of a blurr either way.

It would also be noted that they are a hostile faction, as an end-all notation to this train of thought.

I'm not sure what to say in regards to Uldum-- I always assumed they were Wastewanders conscripted from Tanaris on the way into Uldum. It was never fully clarified one way or another as far as I had heard. In the end, while this is true;

absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

The same could be said of various things, and we do not wish to pursue that as the outcome here. The admins have stated in the past that this was not allowed, and unless they wish to alter that verdict that's really all that can be said on our end.

[Thoradin]

Just because some of them are hostile, shouldn't mean that they are non-playable. I mean, if you look at it in those terms, that reduces everything to non-playable. Paladins are hostile to everything against the Light, Orcs against humans.


I just find it to be, frankly, a bit stupid to limit possible avenues of roleplay, simply because "a group of them are hostile." Maybe they can't be part of the main group, sure, but the character could be an exile or something. Just my thoughts on it. I am sure there are others who would agree.