Query: Combat Systems

[Loxmardin]

This is mostly for my own sake as I try to sit down and develop the combat systems for the gladiator guild, but...

Just how complicated and detailed do people want the character sheets to be? I'll repeat that the character sheets I'm working on won't actually be a lot of work for the individual players, but will be something that the DMs for the events will have to keep track of unless the player absolutely wants to keep track on their own (which would be lovely, too!).

... But, anyway. When @McKnighter set up his system for the Blood Knights, he included perks and talent trees that differed from class to class, usually with two or more branches that you could specialize in (be it offensive, defensive or supportive). How would people feel about something similar to it for a gladiator guild? Just how much customization do you want for your characters and how long do you want the progression-ladder to be?

It's already more or less determined that characters just starting out will have a hard time with those who've gained a bunch of experience in the guild. ... That problem will most likely be solved with Tiers in the guild itself, but...

It could also open up the opportunity for special rewards if a low-level character successfully challenges a high-level character and wins.

Of course, this will come with a series of issues mainly due to the characters' capabilities OOCly versus what they've gained in the guild, but this could always be explained with special equipment and routine.

... Give me input!

[Alpharius]

As I read it all in double Dee's voice...

Why not look into GURPS? Could be what you're looking for. It's a pretty simple system.

[Loxmardin]

GURPS?

[Alpharius]

http://gurps.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page

http://gurps.wikia.com/wiki/Creating_A_Character

"Attributes are the four central traits , Strength [ST], Dexterity [DX], Intelligence [IQ], and Health [HT]. These four abilities are used to derive the character's hit points [HP], will power [WP], Perception [Per], and fatigue points [FP]. "

The big difference between GURPS and the DnD system, is it's universal to every setting, and instead of rolling for your stats, you have a point pool in which you distribute into your stats, which then make up character stats, and then you select traits, etc etc... Should be able to keep it simple since this isn't a tabletop environment.

http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/gu...sheet.html

http://www.themook.net/files/rpg/Charact...enshot.jpg

[Loxmardin]

I'll be looking into those later. I do still want more input from others as well (about the GURPS thingie, in addition).

[McKnighter]

I might be little bit biased in this, but I think that McKnighter system works out pretty well. :P

Though I'll be the first to point out that it's not geared for a PvP environment, but I'm sure the perks and trees can be tailored to fit here. Just be careful about making something OP or UP, try to run some trial runs if possible between certain trees and see how it pans out. You'll get some drama if people claim one class/spec is better than others...

Welcome to multiplayer development. xD

[Loxmardin]

The way I was thinking was to make a character sheet creation system akin to how it looks in Dark Heresy, for example, with full on tables for perks you can purchase as you level up with prerequisites and whatnot in place. ... Slightly more complicated, but with a lot more freedom instead of a specific table per class so people can specialize wildly and in all sorts of directions.

... Hmm.

[Hawk]

I've honestly been waiting for a system other than "Roll 50 to smack a bloke". I much prefer a more progressive combat system with talent trees and whatnot.

Though it will be more complicated for a DM to try think up all this stuff.

[Brutalskars]

The problem generally comes to this,
A more precise calculation of statistics, skills, talents, makes more leg work for everyone involved.

It is a great idea for smaller groups, closed rp's, organized beforehand.
Running things on the fly, that is another thing entirely.

If I say, ran BSHG events, and gave people with more exp/time lots o bonuses, or rather a more diverse system. What happens for the people that come and go? Or the less active players in the guild?

I love game systems, I love character creation and tactical advanced combat. Traits, feats, skills.
However, since the server doesnt have a real-time character stat holder, like some awesome mod that maps across all accounts/characters all their stats. If you want to have a more progressive and involving system, it is better suited for an organized group of players. Like a DnD Party.

[Reigen]

I've personally never been in favor of a complex system for combat. Because, in short, it rewards older players and it creates a bit of an imbalance for new players who join the server who, by all rights, are at the same power level as any other character. A perks system sort of takes away from that.

"I joined this event, but everyone else was more powerful than me. I sort of don't want to do that again as it just made my character look weak."

At least with the standard /roll system, everyone has the very same chance as everyone else, vs perks which make other characters stronger in events. It's also more for players to keep in mind on top of everything else.

Basically - I'm not a fan of anything that will make some characters more powerful than others, as it alienates newer players.

[Loxmardin]

I think that's part of what I want, though, Reigen.

A sense of progression in the guild that offers very solid rewards for the people that actually participate actively (and with balancing perks on the side to let newer players progress faster to catch up with those who have been in the loop for longer).

I know a lot of guilds fail because they're static. Their population is static, and they never go anywhere. They're all at the same level at all times and never progress in any direction aside from, perhaps, storyline-wise. And not even there, in some cases.

[Reigen]

I think the last thing we want to do is start making it so newer players have to play 'catch up' at all, however. After a certain point, that just gets discouraging. The point of guild events, in part, is to encourage people to get active with the guild due to having fun with the group. How much fun can it be to jump in on an event only to get over-shadowed by everyone else there, making your contributions meaningless? Sure, I just hit that mob for one damage, but three others just one-shotted the same thing and now I'm going to get 'KSed' and get patted on the head by an older member who gives me a 'better luck next time kid' speech.

Dunno about others, but that would just kill my want to interact with that group. Length of time on the server should never dictate how 'good' a character is in an event.

[Loxmardin]

Well, I hope that won't become a problem. I've ideas for how to sort that gap out (such as low-level and high-level never actually meeting eachother in tournaments and the like) with perks and benefits for all "tiers" with specific kinds of events for all. I believe that it'd give more a sense of purpose to the guild itself and the characters in it, and something for people to look forward to as they progress all the while enjoying the perks of their current "level".

That's just how things are going to be, though. Someone who comes in later will have to start from square one, and it'll be very rewarding for them when they start to climb as well instead of a blanket level for everyone where they can't go anywhere. PvP, for instance, will still be regulated so there's a fair enough chance for everyone. And even if a low-level winds up in PvP with a high-level, the high-level character wouldn't get any rewards for that. The low-level would benefit from the fight no matter if they win or lose, but even more so if they actually win.

... That's the idea, anyhow. I'd rather encourage climbing than hold everyone back, so to speak.

[Brutalskars]

That is exactly why I approach open events with such neutrality, if one of my guildies nearly dies and the random newcomer kicks some serious butt. It happens.

I was thinking over a possible way of implementing such a thing, but it would take bajillions of hours to organize every character that ever wanted to 'save' their data with the DM.
Thus it is an option, and make the upgrades/traits minimal but enough to make people feel more accomplished maybe?
IDK, Complex stats, progressive power is better suited for a certain group. You would need to have people join and log their stats with you. And then you would have to keep track of the variables, changes, etc.

Avacyn forbid that you somehow lose the data.

[Loxmardin]

Google docs.

*Angelic choir*