Return from the old days?

[FlyingSquirrel]

No living death knights anymore. Bam, done. Gone forever. The concept, whilst possible, is unlikely as all get-out, and we have unimaginably more living than dead. While the ritual doesn't -involve- yourndeath, you'd likely be killed in order to keep you from struggling. Therefore, I say we slash living DKs as a possibility. Or, alternatively, run them as Specials, I don't know.

Quoted for truth.

I disapprove that 'living' death knights is even an -option-. It seems to go against all lore surrounding them and just does not make seance at all to me. Its like having a living vampire from mythology. It just does not make sense.

I would like to see a pole that argues if living death knights should exist at all because that is different from if deathnkights, as a whole, should be up for permission. Deathknights are like roleplaying most other undead.

'living' death knights shouldn't exist because then they are, defacto, not -death-knights. By the same factor that you cant be a forsaken if your character doesn't pass the prerequisite of being, you know, dead.

Actually, I'd like for the arguments or argumentative pieces to stay out this time. Just let people have their opinions, un influenced.

[Dragonbeard]

I haven't bothered to read the other seven pages of posts, so sorry if this is redundant.

Unless we advocate the roleplay of any other generation besides that which you can roll in-game, better known as a third generation Death Knight, then there is no possible way for the Death Knight to be "alive."

First generation Death Knights were created by Gul'dan, and are essentially the soul of an orc warlock that was bound to the corpse of a fallen knight of Azeroth. They were very much dead and very different from the modern concept of a Death Knight.


This is quoted from Turin because I'm too lazy to retype it all myself, but what he says is true:
"There is a great deal of confusion between the Second and Third Generations of Death Knights due to many similarities. They both work for/were created by the Scourge, wield runeblades, and are undead. However, the similarities stop there.

Second Gens, as opposed to Third Gens, gave up their will to the Lich King freely in exchange for power. This power being actual spells, a vampiric runeblade, and the command of legions of undead. They are truly a caster/melee hybrid and an antithesis of Paladins. These powerful beings of evil and death are also very few in number and no two are the same.

Third Gens on the other hand, have had their free will stripped of them. They were then handed a runed blade of insignificant power, given a suit of armor, and told to kill. They are truly nothing more than a cookie cutter shock troop; produced en masse to overwhelm those opposed to the Scourge. All Knights of the Ebon Blade (yes, even Darion, Thassarian, and Koltira) and Hand of Suffering members are included in this group."

So basically, if your Death Knight is alive, they are the Prestige-class version of a Death Knight and must have been someone who pledged themselves to the Lich King by choice. You would then most certainly be allied with the Scourge.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Dragonbeard, I'd asked just above you for people not to post argumentative pieces, or things that may sway ones opinion. If a person does it again, I'll just lock the thread to stop it from happening. I don't want it to turn into another flame thread.

Nothing personal about you, of course. I don't even know you, I just don't really want another argument to erupt.

[Spiralin]

Are you able to add death knights for prestige? In the poll, that is.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Scratch that, I have no clue how to. Regardless, I don't think the GM team would be okay with going back -that- far. Death Knights already are a base class, and then we'd have the number of Living Death Knights already up asking for bonuses, and such.

[Dragonbeard]

The post wasn't meant to be an argument, forgive me. I don't want to start a flame war, either. Perhaps I should just say that it is in my opinion that based on lore and how strongly we appear to adhere to it:

If Death Knights are alive, they should be special, if even allowed.

If they are dead (generation three), then they don't necessarily fit the prestige class' description and could be normal.

That is my opinion, at least.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Yes, I know, but (and I'm guilty of this), people -will- disagree with your opinion and, from there, that could easily evolve to a flame war. Plus, in your avatar, is that Fandral?

[Binkleheimer]

I voted the "Let it be" option.
Why? I find the lore to be vague.
And that this is one of those things that is so minor, I can just ignore it.
That and if I don't like it, I just avoid them.
Ignore lists are useable here.

[Dragonbeard]

is that Fandral?

Hah! It might as well be! No, I found this a while back. It was just a cool avatar to have because my main's name in retail was Lionell. Plus, who doesn't love flaming lions?

[FlyingSquirrel]

I voted the "Let it be" option.
Why? I find the lore to be vague.
And that this is one of those things that is so minor, I can just ignore it.
That and if I don't like it, I just avoid them.
Ignore lists are useable here.

Really, Binkle? I -really- don't want to have to ask a GM to lock this. For future reference.

PLEASE DO NOT POST ANYTHING THAT CAN SWAY ONE'S OPINION. IN OTHER WORDS, DON'T POST ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE TOPIC AT ALL.

Odd request, I know, but I deeply do not want another flame war.

[Binkleheimer]

Then why a thread about a touchy subject like this?
I don't even have the appropriate simile for this kind of thing.
Hell, why bother updating the poll? Of course people are going to comment when they vote.
If you're going to worry about a flame war erupting, then don't post in a thread that created one...
Much less start a poll.

[Esthrunil]

To be frank, I agree with Binkleheimer in this case. Binkleheimer said just about everything I was going to.

At any rate, I voted, "keep it as is," because the argument's gotten so worn out for me that I no longer care.

[FlyingSquirrel]

Because, Binkle, I want people to post -their- opinions, not the opinions of who can use the biggest words.

[Dragonbeard]

Because, Binkle, I want people to post -their- opinions, not the opinions of who can use the biggest words.

I know we just made up for my blunder a minute ago, but I do have to point out one flaw in this logic.

If one is uneducated about something (say for example, they do not know anything about cars) then it would not make much sense for them to talk about cars.

That can be applied here. Warcraft's lore is so very vast and continually retconned. It isn't unlikely that someone is simply unaware of the situation with this class in the lore, whether it be from an in-game, or out-of-game source. It would be much like me giving an opinion on child birth. Never done it, never will. (Don't have the parts.)

[FlyingSquirrel]

They can ask a question asking about it. They can ask something like "Hey, what happened x and y times?" However, I don't want people arguing their case as to why they voted this.