IC economy Idea and Explanation!

[Aadora]

DISCLAIMER:

None of the information below is in any way supported by GMs, a rule, or accepted at all as far as I am concerned. This is simply ideas I thought I would throw out there with all the talk about an economy going on. I do not in any way expect anything below to become reality.

First up, housing!

Now you can take one look at the prices below and say:

"Whoa! Aadora come on now, it would take forever to save up that much money!"

Well, that is the point.

Below are some reasons for this.

Reason 1: Housing takes a lot of work for GMs to manage, so we don't want people constantly having houses built.

Reason 2: The server is getting new members all the time. And no offense to the Peons, but I don't think we would want non-grunts to have access to this kind of thing. And I don't see anyone being able to pull together a price like what is below before hitting grunt. Unless you are Stranger...

Reason 3: Houses are a one time thing for many. You don't just buy a house here, and a house over there. You have a home, and that's it. Maybe you can save up money and add on to it, upgrade perhaps. But you don't need to be owning your own town.

Proposed prices for housing.

Manor - 100g
Two Story House - 50g
One room house - 25g

Next up, vehicles.

Now vehicles are not at all as expensive as houses, and are definitely not as time consuming for GMs to take care of. However, there are only a couple and only one per faction that can be used like a normal mount.

Titan Gyrocopter: 15g
Gnomish Gyrocopter: 10g
Bike: 5g

Next up, shops!

We all like the idea of owning our own shop right? Okay maybe not. But hey, some might like the idea. So how much do you think a shop would cost in say, the Trade District of Stormwind? A tailoring shop around the canals?

Well since there aren't many shops, and most of the existing ones are Alliance anyways, they shouldn't be too much and I doubt they would generate an income other than through players that like to hand over IC currency during RP.

Now you will notice it starts pretty high. I am basing this section off of the supply of said types of buildings and the kind of place it is.

Tavern: 50g
Little shop: 10g
Little Traveling Cart: 5g

Now!

This little idea thread has been all about what big things you can buy. So what small things are there to buy? We have already discussed and decided that any kind of clothing, armor or weapon is out of the question, unless you can find someone willing to pay IC currency for it, which is unlikely.

So what about Jewelry?

Think about it! You can't .addrp an item like a necklace or a ring. The best you can do is put it in your TRP2 or mention it in an emote or OOC. But what about actually having the item made for you?

There are all kinds of special things that. Noble rings, Wedding rings, Diamond or other jeweled necklaces.

While you can buy these things like the Noble ring in OOCC ( For 2400 gold mind you. ) It just doesn't feel right unless you get it from someone does it?

And besides! If we get a good economy go, maybe we can get those items removed from OOCC vendors!

Yeah yeah... I know what you are thinking to that.

Spoiler:

Here are the prices anyways, they range depending on what they are made of or what jewels are involved.

Noble Signet Ring - 20g
Bracelets - 1-5g
Necklaces - 1-5g
Rings - 50s-5g

What's next?

Why don't you tell me? There is a whole world of things to explore that we could bring in and create an economy with.

People running bathhouses.
A certain someone running a matchmaking business.
Some people selling their own inventions.

Those are just some random things I thought of off the top of my head.

So let me ask you.

Why can't we make an economy?

We have the means to do it, we just need the people interested in figuring it out!

[Rigley]

...Er.

In regards to homes, allow me to just quote my response to Krent's thread.

I'm not going to touch on the entirety of this because it is quite late, but concerning the idea of more housing...

There's a ton of housing. Really, I've stapled down a house in Elwynn, Westfall and etc. wherever I found that it would look good to have one. It isn't quite as simple as "I want a home in Stormwind" or "I want a home by Goldshire" because you have to factor in if the terrain will allow that and allow that in a way which is visually acceptable.

Even then, I am sad to say that that is also an extremely limited prospect. Of all of the races the only ones we really have spawnable architecture for would be humans and undead-- perhaps orcs if you wish to stretch the idea of housing a good deal, and tauren get a tiny hut. We can't add stuff to Eversong or else it surely would have been done already-- we just don't have the objects to spawn. Believe me, if we could I would have added several homes all across the board to the different zones. But even then these homes are really only as good as the ones you see now in Elwynn, Duskwood and so on-- in short, I've not tried to skimp out on the decorating of these things in any way. These are my efforts to give a few player housing options, at least where they can be applicable.

I say that to say this; I'm not certain how many more houses you can add, at least in normal areas. I also do not believe it possible to make a specialized door for each house, nor am I too certain that Kretol would even consent (or perhaps just get around to) such a task-- granted that is coming from my limited knowledge of how the core works, but I doubt it from past experience.

In general though I'm personally not a fan of ownership on an RP server. Because we really should be sharing, especially when you consider that there -aren't- an unlimited supply of homes, bars, and etc to run. If a new player joins and wishes to use one of these, it seems wrong to me that we would have to deny him just because all of the buildings have been gobbled up. Part of this also stems from the fact that, yes, these buildings might be claimed, but how often will they be used? I don't mean that in a way to say that claiming them has no justification, but it seems to me that whenever these areas would not be in use it would be more enriching to the RP of the server in general to allow others to use the buildings instead for their own RP.

As for custom items I'm afraid I voice my same concern as to how practical this would be, as only Kretol has the power to really implement such things, especially ones involving effects or the like.

I by no means mean to be the big naysayer here, but I'm just not confident as to how much could be done with the suggestion of housing, in particular.


EDIT: I don't mean to seem like I'm groveling on behalf of my own work, but why are we discussing more housing options when the currently available ones are seldom ever used, by the by? I understand that they might not look -exactly- as one would want them to, but again-- that's a bit of an unreasonable demand. We only have so much space, and so many people. The best we can do is to create homes and then let you pick from the ones which suit you best.

[Aadora]

It's not about how hard it is or whether it can be done.

It's just about showing that in about 10 minutes of work I made all this up and smooshed all these ideas together.

All we have to do is -try- to make an economy and make it work among those of us who want one.

The problem is we are stuck on

"Oh it won't work."

Or

"Oh can't sell gear can't have an economy."

But there is so much else we could do if we really wanted to make an economy.

[dastmo]

I agree with Rigley that housing is a bad, bad idea.

On the shops... yeah, most of the good ones are Alliance-side, but why wouldn't it be possible to just get a few caravans spawned and use them. I mean, there are some in Elwynn Forest from what I've seen, where would be the problem to add a few in other areas? And maybe a handful of buildings that look like shops here and there? Voila, feel free to use them.

Real estate in general is a bad idea in my opinion.

The other stuff can be made through crafting (or GHI for those more special items). So, basically, we -do- have the foundations for economy to appear. Yes, the value of things is greatly relative, considering the supply-demand thing that was mentioned in Rigley's blog, but it can be done with common sense and some creativity. I believe that the only thing we actually need in order to get a working economy is general pointers on prices in Azeroth. With creativity and some common sense, we'll be able to make it work. In-game mechanics are hardly what we need, I believe.

Then again, just my 2 copper.

[Rigley]

I would argue that considering the hindrances is something of a large part when considering throwing support behind ideas. It isn't very wise to blindly throw yourself headfirst into a concept-- sometimes the criticism is valid, and in this case I think it would at least deserve some kind of placating thought put towards it rather than just writing it off as coming from a naysayer.

Trying is good, but you need to plan first. You need to understand what troubles you might run into so you can try and work around them when they arise.

Heck, I spent hours when I was trying to fully draft up my ideas for IC currency. Clearly I didn't think through everything-- in fact I would argue I neglected some pitfalls because I was so sure the idea would take off. I was confidant that the thing could support itself with some minor guidance-- it could not. From experience it is better to consider the problems, and then proceed from there. No matter how slow a process that may be. Being thorough pays off in the long run. Because in the end 'if it can or cannot be done' is a very serious thing to consider before you put your efforts behind a project.


EDIT: @dastmo, caravans added in other areas is surely a possibility. As for shop-like buildings, those are once more quite limited in what can be built. Again, it is largely constrained to human architecture, though by a stretch perhaps some orcish objects could be used.

[Aadora]

Eh... repost because this was rude and sloppy.


Honestly, I think we need to move away from housing as it's already been made pretty clear it's a bad idea.

[Rigley]

Aye, the original post did come off as very offensive.

I didn't see any indication where the idea of housing had been dropped; and while I was not attempting to draw attention to my work, I was only pointing out that such spawns already exist.

Apologies, but that was the opener to this topic, and it's the one that pertained most to me-- so yes, I am prone to focus on that.

Upon the rest of the subjects though I am becoming increasingly pushed towards the idea of a less structured economy. At least, certainly not one which is very regulated. I suppose that could be seen as the cheap way out and it of course does not provide for the issues which led to IC currency being implemented in the past, but it just seems more... Enjoyable, in a way. Perhaps due to the virtue of simplicity alone.

[Beltharean]

One way I could see the economy quickly and easily being pushed in the right direction, would be to give players when they finish their quest, 9 gold coins, 99 silver, and 100 copper. This might seem silly, especially with the currency exchange vendors, but as it stands not many people bother breaking their currency down into smaller chunks before they go out to RP. If they have a nice array of copper and silver already lined up for them, they might be more willing to spend it. It follows the same train of logic so to speak, as it does to only carry large bills when you wish to be frugal; You're less to break a hundred dollar bill for something that costs a dollar to just hand over that original dollar. Like I said, it may seem silly but... After breaking down my currency for the first time in a while, I spent more money than I have in a long time ICly.

[Aadora]

I think a less structured economy is better, because it would keep us from having to pull everyone else in to get it to work.

And don't apologize, I was the one being rude.

[Harmonic]

The hard part is, and economy where only a few take place doesn't usually work.

I mean, that's sort of the system we have now. You either take part in the money exchange, or you don't. Most people opt not to, so the only real use for the money is Cressy's auction or whatever else comes up, heh.

...Again, I gotta start charging IC money for IC drink.

[Aadora]

Casey WAS going to give Rensin about 5 gold to pay for any drinks for members of the house.

But he was too busy being attracted to a man.

[DaveM]

The problem with IC money for IC drink is - every other spot doesn't charge IC money for IC drink, making you (infinitely) the most expensive seller.

[Harmonic]

Which is why the idea of an economy seems good, but in reality if everyone doesn't participate, it doesn't work. My bar is supposed to be cheap, ICly.