Rambling

[Zhaei]

So I've been considering making a thread to sum up my random thoughts for a while now. The topic should always revolve around CotH (albeit somewhat loosely on occasion.) These are also my own views and don't represent anything or anyone. Except me.

Also, feel free to comment on stuff. I'd actually like that, though I doubt it will happen.

1 - Blizzlo(l)re.

As of the last almost nine months, I've started to extensively research Warcraft lore. I find the universe interesting - probably as it's the first I've really been interested in - though there's many major elements I would change. Should probably write about that soon.

As they are famous for, Blizzard have employed some truly terrible people, it seems. It's common knowledge that they don't care about RP in this setting (Or any, really) which is a shame. But I'd be fine if they just left it there. If they didn't claim Warcraft as a 'universe'. My major problem is that they have so much framework for things but don't explain it! It's like having two thick slices of bread and an olive for filling. It's not cool.

Even taking in the RPG, information is nowhere near abundant enough. To list just a handful of the vast ocean of fail...

• Individual racial politics. More info - Blelves and Humans especially.
  
• Classes! What I would do to get a definitive canon explanation on how X magic works. Training processes, equipment, magic explanation, etc.
  
• Zone lore. What is where, history of the areas. Hell, we don't even know what Felwood was called before Illidan. WTF, Blizzard?
  
• More information on religion. More info on NElf worship and rituals. More Tauren myths. Some real info on Orc spirits. You get the idea.
  
• More names for things! I've noticed many cultures and racial norms seem to lend towards other names for things; Tauren and NElf specifically. I'm kiiiinda bored of calling Ashenvale Ashenvale.
  
• Some actual info on the boundaries of Engineering. There's soooooooooo much creativity to be had here, yet there's so little around.
  
• Just generally more minor info - festivals, celebrations. Aesthetic customs. Rites of passage, significance of tattoos. Etc. The list is eternal.
  
• If there's one thing I'd take. I don't even play Human! Individual lore for the Human kingdoms. PLEASE. Accents, customs, history, armies, politics, rulers, IRL comparisons, stuff like that.
  

That's just a few. I'll probably think of more as I go about the day and add them on. There's hundreds of things. This has kind of turned into a rant but I'm OK with that. /tar Blizzard /shakefist

It's fairly common knowledge that I don't want Cataclysm. Of course, I welcome the change but personally I'd relish staying where we are for a while longer. (which is probable right now anyway) I think the lore's terrible! Utterly abysmal. Thrall comes in and steps in for a Dragon Aspect?! What? Randomly blowing up the world is a lame way of not bothering with real lore. (Seriously. Cata's plot is -Deathwing breaks world. Kill his clan. Kill him.-)

I think Blizzard needs to stop focusing on the future. Of course, we all know they only care about future expos and won't touch current-->past lore ever again. Still, I can rant! They could pay Metzen to spend a week adding content to Wowpedia and stamping his CANON badge on it. Hell, even Knaak. Not Knaak. He's an idiot.

[Wuvvums]

I believe lore is a tricky thing for some MMOs because the main goal, above all else, is to have a useable product and the lore is only going to be relevant in the delivery of products, such as the MMO itself, the novels, or the RPG books. I just don't imagine that anyone gets hired or paid just for generating ideas about something. There needs to be some actual product about it. They can expand the lore but it's not necessary for delivering the product.

I think this mostly comes up because personally I've seen a lot of people who wanted to get a video game made for their own character or world concepts. They've come up with some thoughts about a culture, and a place, and a setting. And I've seen some of them ask around seeing if they could get people just to make things for their ideas. And they don't understand that you can't really come in just being the thought-guy. There needs to be some contribution whether it's in art, or coding, or providing the money to get server space.

I just think this is related to the thought that we're very critical on blizzard because they don't make enough ideas or put enough thoughts forward. Why would they? How would they do it? Is it worth it to publish manuals and guides? I just don't think there's a lot of demand for them to increase publication of their lore. They are primarily a gaming company so when they hire on people, they're probably going to focus on getting the people who get the job done, such as writers for a specific story, art direction, rendering, testing and so on. I just can't really find this as something to fault a company for.

I am curious; would we similarly demand other game companies to tell us everything about their game's universe, culture, and people? Would that compliance change the quality of the product and the experience?

[Zhaei]

Aye, agreed.

It's common knowledge that they don't care about RP in this setting

I think that they should put more info up. I'm not saying explain every last detail, but there are some huge gaps which they would do well to fill. RPers are as much customers as raiders; should they get less content? Obviously, it's a moot point but the logic is there. But really, I'm fairly sure all Chris Metzen does is lore (And a spot of voice acting.) With a company as colossal as Activision Blizzard, I'm fairly sure they'd be all right hiring a couple of people to simply write lore.

I am curious; would we similarly demand other game companies to tell us everything about their game's universe, culture, and people? Would that compliance change the quality of the product and the experience?

If the game companies advertised roleplay as part of the gaming experience, then yes. Blizzard has RP servers and established lore - but they don't enforce rules, they ignore RPers' feedback and leave us with incomplete lore. If there wasn't RP/RPPVP servers then they'd have no excuse. But imagine if they suddenly stopped coding in PvP gear because it's not important to them.

[Kage]

In a way it's up to the Rpers to fill the gap. Perhaps Blizzard thought "well if we dictate how -everything- must go, where's the imagination left?" Maybe we as a rp server should fill in some of the gaps ourselves. Course I'm not known for my longer in depth posts, but my point is this, why not make some of the lore ourselfs? I mean, so long as it doesn't conflict with lore already around (I.E Arthas was born in Felwood before it was called felwood :B) but I don't think it could hurt. Perhaps we could even throw it at Blizzard and say "If you don't want to make it, here, we did."

[Wuvvums]

I kind of find it to be an unreasonable demand to expect a business to enforce rp within their game. I also don't think I've ever seen a company that caters in rp itself. I've seen rp servers like in guild wars with virtually no rp, mostly because rp is not a thing provided by a company but by its player-base. Someone also has to consider that moderating rp means that they would have to hire people solely for the purpose of quality control. Then one has to consider that it would probably make drama way bigger than what we would ever see on coth, because of the implications that a company is policing its player base over the lore-accuracy.

That being said I think they probably wanted a hands-off approach in that players can define their characters and their experiences and their interpretations on culture and the world around them. They only provide a setting; it's up to the rpers to work out the rest.

This is just my opinion. Rp in the end is a hobby and a sort of niche one at that. I haven't seen a company cater solely to roleplaying and it was usually secondary or optional.

[Jonoth]

The real question for them is: if we complete the lore, will more people buy subscriptions? Also, from a storytelling point of view, by not revealing too much of the past, they can always add things in as will help them tell the current story. So if for example they make New Bad Guy #34567, they don't have to go read their entire lore to figure out how to justify him, because it's vague enough that they can create some noble house that was always there, and that only played a minor role until now.

[CappnRob]

FYI Felwood before Illidan was just another part of Ashenvale. In lore, Ashenvale is HUGE (not that it's small in game...).

[Dae]

The real question for them is: if we complete the lore, will more people buy subscriptions? Also, from a storytelling point of view, by not revealing too much of the past, they can always add things in as will help them tell the current story. So if for example they make New Bad Guy #34567, they don't have to go read their entire lore to figure out how to justify him, because it's vague enough that they can create some noble house that was always there, and that only played a minor role until now.

What I don't understand is why there aren't more Warcraft spin-offs. I mean, would it really be that bad of an investment to pull a Bethesda and make RPGs for each race? I mean, they could even keep it really small scale by making it a smartphone title, or something. Just throw a small team of developers together with some nerds who really really like that race. Let them go a little nuts with superfluous NPC dialogue and in-game books, or something.
And then, they could mandate that it would somehow build up a future important character, and it would make the lore fans happy, and make Blizz a quick buck. I'm certain there's money to be had here somewhere.

[Zhaei]

with some nerds who really really like that race

Yes please. So much of my yes please.

[SpiralLateralus]

Blizzard has been more of a profit driven company since WoW was released (from what I hear about diablo 3 it would not have sold as well had it not been named diablo 3 and published by them) . I already made a topic covering that though.

What I'm trying to say is that they are more interested in gameplay at this point, they are trying to make fun games not fantasy epics. If you are looking for that you can always read the Lord of the Rings/Game of Thrones/Inheritance/Harry Potter etc. Or play the Elder Scrolls (I hear dey be making an MMO of that).

as for WoWRP you will find the best experience on private servers. at this point you may as well call the public RP servers ERP servers.

[Jonoth]

What I don't understand is why there aren't more Warcraft spin-offs. I mean, would it really be that bad of an investment to pull a Bethesda and make RPGs for each race? I mean, they could even keep it really small scale by making it a smartphone title, or something. Just throw a small team of developers together with some nerds who really really like that race. Let them go a little nuts with superfluous NPC dialogue and in-game books, or something.
And then, they could mandate that it would somehow build up a future important character, and it would make the lore fans happy, and make Blizz a quick buck. I'm certain there's money to be had here somewhere.

I think a lot of that is "maintaining the machine". Meaning they could search for new avenues, but likely have become so complacent with the current formula that they don't wanna risk derailing the money train. It's kinda like music. In many genres, people may say that creativity and artistry have fallen way off to cliche and cut-and-paste formulaic nonsense. But at the end of the day, it's a very steady and consistent income for the music industry because people are still buying the music. Blizzard -could- innovate on their own accord, and who knows, maybe they will at some point. But for most companies, it takes adversity to make large change, just as it did to build them up in the first place.

That said, there are a few options. Some people know I've been on Rift the past few months, and one of the things they have are slivers, which are divergent timelines created when an important historical event changes. I bring this up because something like that could allow Blizzard to create new content while maintaining a more defined central timeline. So their main timeline could be the heroes defeat Garrosh, while one sliver is where Garrosh wins and enslaves the Alliance, and you the hero fight an apocalyptic future in order to overthrow the regime of darkness (or aid it, if you are totally into Garrosh as Warchief). And maybe through some kind of in game voting some slivers could come to pass as canon. The possibilities are endless, but there must be a return on the investment for them to consider it.