Question on alignment.

[Amerason]

Alignment isn't that important, to be honest. I prefer to see a well written personality section than what alignment the creator thinks fits best. Alignments are very subjective too, so what one person might deem neutral or evil another might see as good.

I personally have to say Nostra is totally right on this one, but by all means, peruse which ever works for you. :P

EDIT: I actually cut out Alignment on most of my character profiles now.

[Jurkey]

@Therew: Well, he would never hurt an innocent and he tends to protect the innocents and those close to him.

[therew]

@Therew: Well, he would never hurt an innocent and he tends to protect the innocents and those close to him.

Exactly. His evil is controlled on a personal level. I'm sure when your character looks in the mirror he sees a hero or someone who has to do what he does to make the world a better place. Heck he may even see himself as a sacrificial lamb, seeing himself as someone who became evil to protect the weak so they wont have to do what he is doing to make the world a better place. These are all ways a lawful evil person would act and from what you presented as his traits it appears to me that you have a Lawful evil champion of good on your hands. Always a fun character type, I've played one many of times before.

The confusion of the alignment table though is something even Gary Gygax, its creator, admits happens because the table is not suitable for describing complex characters. I've had alignment discussions so many times with friends and you have little idea how many times Lawful good and Lawful evil have over lapped in these talks. Where Lawful good and Neutral good overlapped, but the funny thing is Lawful evil and Neutral good never gotten mixed up. The whole thing can become a jumbled mess. If I am not mistaken Coth does not require you to give an alignment, which is good it saves time. When in doubt don't go Chaotic Neutral. That is not the rp how ever you want alignment.( In-fact if you ask me thats one of the hardest aliments to pull off, that and the entire lawful side of the table) When in doubt, ask about. Discussion is key.

[c0rzilla]

People who say they are the "good guys" are liars, and people who say they are "evil" are probably just insane (ICly). This all comes down to psychology. People who have done acts we consider "evil" do not think they are committing evil, they think they are somehow doing something good. Bank robbers, for example, don't rob banks to steal others money, they do it because they believe it to be the only way they can get money. Now they probably know they are taking others money, but they believe themselves to be more deserving of it, that it's owed to them.

My character Mordus didn't do what he did because he's like "Lolololol I'm evil", he did what he did because he believed what he was doing was the right thing. You may call it evil, he'd call it getting what he wants.

Conversely, so called "good guys" can commit "evil" deeds. Police brutality etc. I'd argue that King Varian is a tyrant, since it could be said that any talk of say, making Stormwind a democracy, would probably result in the arrest and maybe execution of those who started such talk. Simply because King Varian wants to remain King. When he fights the orcs, it's not because orcs are the "bad guys" (that is what he tells he citizens), it's because he doesn't like them. The reasons for such can be argued, but at the end of the day, he's trying to eliminate the Horde because they are different. The same goes for Garrosh.

Sorry, I don't mean to rant, but I'm just pointing out why "character alignment" in a profile is mainly so that people can expect what that character might do ICly.

And what of the people that know they make mistakes and work to right them? Know their imperfections? Sounds perfectly good to me. A saint? No, but no one is. I really don't buy your argument. An Old God worshipper (as an example) is evil, if he goes around corrupting, no matter what he may think he's doing.

[Spiralin]

Well technically the worshipper believes in the old-god to be good, so he may think of himself doing good, just in his own special way.


Edit: Good is a matter of perspective that we as humans have derived to try and maintain order. Just as some parents would allow their children to curse around the house, and says it's okay. While others may say that's bad.

[c0rzilla]

...No, sorry. I get that he -thinks- he's doing good, and it's a sad case. But, his actions are still evil and horrible.

[Aphetoros]

That's your perspective.

[Spiralin]

Exactly, you -think- he's doing evil and horrible things. He -thinks- he's doing great and wonderful things. What you believe as a human, is that, things like that are evil and horrible. But what if you were raised like the worshipper?

[CharizardDylan]

That being said, does a person's mindset determine their moral standing?

I mean those who worship the old gods may think that the old gods are good, but they are evil and any action that the person does, thinking he is just, is still just as wrong as someone who kills innocents just for the fun of it.

It is the same reason the world finds the Twilight's Hammer to be just as evil as any other threat.

[Knock]

IMO the alignment system isn't really about what your character thinks of their own actions.

It's more about how their actions and motivations will be interpreted by society as a whole.

Otherwise pretty much everyone would be good. Everyone sees their actions as being beneficial, whether it's just for themselves or for the world in general.

Of course there are exceptions, but that's the general trend.

[Aphetoros]

Yar. I was playing Devil's Advocate. The thing about alignment is this: A creature's general moral and personal attitudes. What makes good and evil is usually defined by the society and not the individual. Good is what the entirety of Azeroth would interpret as a good action. Even if they differ in opinion, most sane, well-thinking people would think killing babies is evil.

[iHollow]

In my opinion, I'm going to say Neutral or Lawful Evil. Because for what Coriv does, it all comes together to land in the neutral spot.. but with the 'evil' acts he does, even though he doesn't kill innocents.. that can fall into Lawful Evil, or am I wrong? Either way, alignment doesn't really matter..

[Knock]

I'd say more Chaotic Good.

He kills those that society would deem 'evil', e.g. Necromancers, Demons, Warlocks, etc. But it's more of an 'ends justify the means' approach. And the relish in killing is part of the 'Chaotic' attribute.

[Jurkey]

This is what I find so hard, that he can be Chaotic Good and Lawful Evil, which are exact opposite. He kills evil, like Knock said - but he also likes the power that he got by being the leader of a guild, and being a powerful man is something that suits him. He would never abuse it though, but he tends to be rather proud of it - and it makes people keep their fingers off him.

[c0rzilla]

Here's some quotes from TV Tropes.

Lawful Good
"Law is order, and good law is good order."
— Aristotle
"The Lawful Good alignment is often thought of as the most blatantly good of the good guys, and is commonly stereotyped as such. Utopias tend to be composed entirely of good, honest Lawful Good citizens."

"Role played well, a Lawful Good character can be incredibly interesting, and occasionally face some very difficult decisions. What's really right? Shall I do the Lawful thing, or do the Good thing? Obey the letter of the law, or save the innocents? This can lead to a To Be Lawful Or Good decision."

"While the key difference between Lawful Good and Neutral Good is the belief that upholding law/honor/social mores/etc. is required to set a proper example for others or to prevent a philosophical Moral Dissonance, the key difference between Lawful Good and Lawful Neutral is the recognition that laws/honor/social mores/etc. exist only to protect the Greater Good, and will actually consider whether those strict guidelines really accomplish their tasks, rather than simply enforcing the rule for the rule's own sake."

Neutral Good
"I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong."
—Frederick Douglass

"The Character Alignment of sweetness and light. A Neutral Good character will usually comply with laws if doing so benefits the greater good, but rebel against those they consider unjust or which conflict with the greater good."

And this form is horrible with IE, so that's all you get for now. ;p