Reigen Requests: Event Etiquette

[Reigen]

Most everyone who plays on this server knows that events are an important part of the server for spurring up RP, getting characters to meet other characters and all around keeping us busy when we’d otherwise be sitting around the OOC zone. They happen often, at least once a week and can be run by anyone.

Running events can sometimes be hectic. The DMs have a lot on their plate, such as remembering where things are, boss dialogue, keeping track of rolls and making sure no one gets a turn skipped. It’s not as easy as some people tend to think. It gets even harder when the DM is bombarded with questions and suggestions by players, or when players refuse to follow rules.

It can be very frustrating when a DM is trying to run an event and people keep assuming things and pestering the DM with what they think is right. I’m not sure about everyone else, but in my events, there is some etiquette I’d like the players to follow.

• A character is not the big damn hero.

This is copyrighted to Immy, but I’m going to use it anyway. Nothing irritates me more than someone trying to play the big hero who snips out cheesy one-liners at the boss and expects to be a big deal in the event. It can get annoying and it can make the DM spiteful to the character. Everyone is equal in an event unless otherwise said. Everyone is the hero. Please stop trying to make the character more important than anyone else.

• ‘Last one out’

We’re all guilty of doing this at one point in time. The room was a trap, everyone has to flee the area before the monsters get them or the roof falls down on our heroes. However…everyone wants to seem the tragic caring hero and wants to be the last person to leave the situation. This gets to the point where people just stand around waiting for someone to move first so they can be the last one out.

This is annoying to no end. It does not make someone look a hero…it makes that person hold up the event. When the DM gives a queue that it’s time to leave…please just leave. Don’t hold up the event to be the last one out.

• ‘My character is a big deal’

Another thing I see a lot is players trying to get the DM to have event NPCs recognize a character. Please don’t ask people to do this. If they’ve heard of the character, then great. If not, don’t act like the character is a huge deal, most of all if the event contains lore figures. As far as they know, the character doesn’t even exist. This can also distract the DM from the event when they have to respond to whispers asking if a character can be important.

• Telling the DM how to run their event

This has happened to me a few times, and let me say, it sours the whole mood for me. Let the DM run their event. If anyone thinks it could have been done better another way, post in their feedback thread. Do not whisper the DM during the event and start telling them how they should do it. Frankly, it’s rather insulting. Unless it’s a huge deal, such as skipping over turns constantly/ignoring someone, just let the DM run the event the way they want to run it. If a person dislikes how an event is run, then the best thing to do is not attend future events. Don’t try to control what the DM does/how they set it up.

This also goes for giving the DM ‘advice’ for how to run the event. The DM had something in mind well before the event started and changing in the middle of it is not something that can be, or really should be done. Once again, if advice has to be given, do it in the feedback thread after the event is over.

• Bragging about ‘getting the kill’.

This is something I see in almost every combat event ever done. There is a big baddie who the group has been working on getting too and taking down for almost the whole event. This is the end boss, the guy who sticks out like a sore thumb. After a long battle, the DM calls for everyone to roll and that the highest roll gets the honor of striking down the big bad. Someone rolls a 100 and emotes their kill, no matter how epic or simple it may be…

And then they start to brag about it both ICly and OOCly. Several people have complained to me about this, which is one of the reasons I try not to say who exactly kills the big-baddies in my events. I can understand what they’re getting at too. It really gets upsetting that someone is essentially rubbing it in your face because the Random Number Generator [RNG] gave them a better number. It’s not cool, yo.

Taking down the villain is a group effort, not one person should ever take credit unless they were up there soloing it with no help from anyone else. If the character is one who would take it that way and brag about it, so be it, but know it’s not going to earn them any friends. Bragging about it OOCly is just something that should not be done, it’s kind of degrading to everyone else who was involved in the event.

• Not listening to event rules

I’ve seen this happen and have heard about it far too often. Players will be given IC instructions; sometimes this comes OOCly over Raid Warning messages. Everyone gets out into the event zone and…someone starts to do something that the event isn’t even about, or they just don’t follow the rules. Soon after the other players get irritated that someone isn’t listening to the rules, and the event fades into a whole mess up OOC chatter of trying to prove each other wrong.

When a DM states what the event is about and how it should be done, follow these rules. There should be no argument about it. Saying a character would do something that way is not an argument, it just means the player should have brought a different character to the event that would follow the instructions. Disobeying the rules will frustrate the DM who is trying to keep things going, frustrate the players and just slow the event down in general and make it hard to enjoy.

If a DM lists rules for the event, please follow them, no matter what the character would do. This also goes for if the DM tells you to whisper/whatever them when special items/attacks/someone investigates something. Following emotes can be hard.

• Infighting

I’ve only seen this happen a couple of times, enough so that it’s not really a big deal, but I feel it should be mentioned anyway. When trying to host an event, the last thing a DM should have to worry about is two players attacking each other in the middle of it. If two characters really need to duke it out, wait until after the event, don’t give the DM another headache to follow and fix.

This is all I can think of for now. Everyone is free to add to it or make their own. I know I’ve covered most of the things that have bothered me or bothered those who I talk to often enough.

[Wuvvums]

I really like these and the explanations.

Can I add on that I would almost suggest with etiquette to find ways to cut back on OOC chatter? I remember cases where it was hard to keep organized because you have 20 rolls, but then people have to chit chat in the raid. I know I remember one event I helped run where I had to request at least 3 times to quite the chatter, and I think it could be avoided if players requested to be moved to a certain group.

[ImagenAshyun]

Thanks for this, Rei. I have had it with big damn heroes in my events, especially with players trying to hijack the story to show how much of a big deal they are. Among the reasons Gnomeregan was a struggle to DM was because of players trying to upstage Mekkatorque's efforts against Thermaplugg's forces. C'mon, you're fighting with the King of Gnomes, that's pretty big damn heroic enough!

[Spiralin]

I agree that even from a player's standpoint, when someone else will try to hog a spotlight, I'll become frustrated. So I'd say not only do a few of the things you listed frustrate GMs, but it will also cause angst with the ones attending the event.

[Cassius]

I always consult with the DMs before engaging in a fight against my partner(s) mid-event.

[Binkleheimer]

Event rules? If you want to railroad an event, then you may as well tell people that before hand. And saying the character would do it another way is an argument. People won't do anything different because you want your event to go off how you want it to the letter. If you just want a predetermined result, why bother with an event?
Don't like people doing things that may throw your event off the rails? Don't DM. Ever. You'll be horribly disappointed.

[Rigley]

Event rules? If you want to railroad an event, then you may as well tell people that before hand. And saying the character would do it another way is an argument. People won't do anything different because you want your event to go off how you want it to the letter. If you just want a predetermined result, why bother with an event?
Don't like people doing things that may throw your event off the rails? Don't DM. Ever. You'll be horribly disappointed.

While it's certainly possible to run events and have lots of open ended-ness to them (typically when the event itself consists of improv), this isn't really possible -all- the time. Certain events need structure, mostly ones which need to be set up in some fashion or another.

To compare to a video game, think of invisible walls. Yes, they're annoying, but a game can't go on forever. You can't prepare for every possible direction a player wants to take their game, and most respond by giving few designed choices from the start.

Now, right-- some people may say it'd be lazy to essentially make the other options empty space. At the same time, the work that could have gone into making said empty space a part of the game has been put to making the intended part of the game better, or longer, or prettier. This is essentially how I would compare things when concerning large-scale events-- While I could make lots of possibilities in them, I can react and work much more efficiently when I am prepared for the outcome and can supply those attending with a quick and thought-out explanation of the situation.

Again, there's a time and place for creative motions in an event-- There are some events I've ran in the place that have no structure to them aside from a specific goal to be accomplished in the way the player deems fit, and those can be fun. But not every event can be orchestrated that way, and when you get large groups then that can be even less of a feasible option.

[ImagenAshyun]

Event rules? If you want to railroad an event, then you may as well tell people that before hand. And saying the character would do it another way is an argument. People won't do anything different because you want your event to go off how you want it to the letter. If you just want a predetermined result, why bother with an event?
Don't like people doing things that may throw your event off the rails? Don't DM. Ever. You'll be horribly disappointed.

The issue isn't so much players taking variables into their own hands as it is trying to hijack the event for the sake of their own personal heroics. Most events, especially combat events, are created because we want other players to be the heroes. The rules established allow variables to occur while still remaining within the DM's control.

Think of this scenario: you're DMing an event where you're saving a burning town from bandits. You want players to shoot down the bad guy on the roof. You want the players to punch bandits in the face. You want to knock down the mage in the back who's plucking your party. You want the players to face down the final thug who looks like he was ripped out of a bad comic book.

What you don't want is one player slapping a saddle onto the final thug's back and putting a bit on him so he can Hulk Smash the rest of the thugs and declare yourself the hero by saving the orphans and widows within the burning buildings by calling upon Deathwing by having Varian and Thrall on speed dial. An exaggerated hyperbole, but that's what most derailing usually entails--claiming you're the hot shot by going out of line and hijacking the story. Not only do you frustrate the DM, you cheat the other players at a chance of good, simple, and orderly fun.

The rules established by DMs is not only to keep things in order, but to keep the event managing less of a headache. Even if DMs have Assistant-DMs, event managing is plenty of mental work. If variables are to occur that may result in derailment, they tend to be detrimental to the players as well as the DM.

Remember that literal derailing does not do any good for the train--it wrecks the wheels, it wrecks the rails, it puts the passengers in danger, and you'll be going to Point B behind schedule due to repairs and getting the train back on track. Story and event derailing is the same way. Players make the ride interesting and enjoyable, but they shouldn't hijack the story. And nobody wants to encounter a real train wreck.

[Binkleheimer]

What you don't want is one player slapping a saddle onto the final thug's back and putting a bit on him so he can Hulk Smash the rest of the thugs and declare yourself the hero by saving the orphans and widows within the burning buildings by calling upon Deathwing by having Varian and Thrall on speed dial. An exaggerated hyperbole, but that's what most derailing usually entails--claiming you're the hot shot by going out of line and hijacking the story. Not only do you frustrate the DM, you cheat the other players at a chance of good, simple, and orderly fun.

If his character beats the roll checks, he can do it.
And honestly, that sounds hilariously awesome.

But in reality, what would happen? He would fail that roll check harder than than a drunk driving in a race. Those thugs would stomp his character into a paste and he'd look like a tool in the process.
Unless you're just doing a "Roll higher than me to succeed" type. In which case, the problem is you're making it too easy for them to hijack your events.

[ChampionMouse]

Unless I'm mistaken, and someone can feel free to correct me if I am... I don't think anybody is trying to "railroad" events. They are asking that players try and keep their actions reasonable while still being heroic and straight forward. (Unless you want your character to just die from being ridiculously stupid in the face of overwhelming odds. That can happen too.) I just like people to remember that the dice rolls are sometimes also there for structure and pacing of an event. It isn't really a "if you can beat this number you can do whatever you want sort of deal."

I think most people who throw events -do- try to go with the punches and adapt to what their players choose to do. However, with the big events (like them lore based ones that people have been doing for Cata) there are outcomes that have already been established, ya know? That is less railroading, and more giving the players a chance to participate in history in the making, I think.

Anyway. People should also understand that sometimes when you get too creative or "funky" with your attacks, it can be hard to interpret or translate in the middle of an event. (Magic/special attacks sometimes end up coming across as a whole other science or sound like some totally overwhelming new language.) Not saying that you shouldn't be creative, but, try and keep it within reason on some level.

Ah dunno. Started rambling. O_o;

[Zhaei]

• Expressing your disdain mid-event
  

Whether it's not liking how an event is being run or the direction it's going, or even just bad rolls, complaining about it in /raid is simply annoying. Especially when you do it in all caps, or each end of every roll. Everyone can see how you're doing. If you have genuine feedback, post it in a thread or over Skype to the DM after the event.

• Vague, ambiguous or otherwise un-descriptive emotes
  

There're so many times when X will just say "/e charges Y enemy" as if that was even close to enough. What can a DM do with that? Sure, if it's a humanoid, you might be able to knock it over, but charging a giant (as has been done many times) gives me nothing to work with. This also goes hand-in-hand with "/e makes an attack at his foe" and "/e strikes his enemy". It's not only awkward for me, it reeks of laziness, too.

[SachikoMaeda]

I try to take it in a positive light.

At least people show for your events. Something to be grateful for I suppose...

[Harmonic]

Very good. I appreciate this so very much, and I think you've hit the nail on the head, Reigen.

[kindle135]

Something I'm surprised you didn't mention:

Patience

There's a lot going on in an event, especially GM run ones, phasing, spawning, killing, keeping track of turns, rolls, and maybe even dealing with questions/complaints. Bottom line: they're only taking their time to take proper consideration for everyone and appeasing everyone's need for NPC visuals and all of those external things.

Equally I believe there needs to be a rule for DMing...

Planning

It's not fun just sitting around, it's understandable that the DMs have things to tend to but there are certain things that can be done to hasten the process, namely apt planning. Making macros of long dialogue scenes before hand can be -extremely- helpful; it gives you time to perfect your writing and it eliminates otherwise wasted time in the event that you would spend typing.

Lastly this is a personal irk of mine and I feel it'd help things go much faster

Succinct emotes - we don't need a sonnet to describe the way in which your character kills his/her anonymous enemy. What you're hitting and how you're hitting it is really all that's necessary. If you're hitting the character count limit you're making it harder for people to actually take into account what you're writing. tl;dr: long emotes =/= good emotes

[Kage]

Hey, I don't slap a saddle on the guys back, bu I certainly try to jump/climb up a larger then my character to do damage to the head kind of thing.

On another note, I completely agree with this thread. Saddly I've done several of those throughout my years, and for those who've noticed/disliked it, I'm terribly sorry.

Anyway, sometimes people like to be a bigger part in the story, and I'll say there's nothing wrong with it. But remember, the time to ask if you can be important isn't during the event, but during the planning of the event. You see "[Insert fancy event name here] begins [state date/time here]" and you like it, ask if you can play a larger roll, it'll save yourself and the DM a large headache.