Lore weapons - IC / OOC

[Azheron]

I have always used the weapons just as models, and not being with the in-game lore.

Just my... cent.

[ThePharaoh]

Maybe I'm indifferent to this conversation, because of the like 50,000 -OTHER- weapons that are pretty awesome. I don't see the point in wanting a Lore weapon, there are enough weapons already.

I am also a firm believer of someone saying, "Can I use this weapon and say it looks similar to this and it -not- be that weapon?" I've witnessed a character use that epic quel das or w/e sword that was listed above, and another char asking to use it. Which the answer was, as long as it's not the lore weapon but just -looks- like it then fine.

and Terant said it best, if people would have a logical reason to ask for it, I'm sure the GM's would work with you. But maybe try looking through all of the other weapons first since there is an ass load of them.

Also this is supposed to be fun, some people like different types of RP. I like big ass swords, I think they look cool sue me. I don't like to be judged by people who sit in taverns all day on what -I- can't weild, because I actually enjoy my combat character. I understand we are aiming for a certain level of realism, and no offense as I know we aren't here to bash other servers. But the level of realism has been obtained. I've been to other servers and thats when you run into -real- mary sue characters, who are leaders of lore organizations dual wielding Frostmourne. Here some people just want a little flashy accent to their character because it suits their style of RP or it is visually appealing to them. Hating someone because of that is just you pointing out your difference in opinion.

Also this is supposed to be fun, I can't stress that enough.... Bashing someone else doesn't support your idea, nor help the other person to correct their mistake ( if there is one ). I've heard Players say The Greatsword of the Sin'Dorei is too epic to use. I've used it around multiple GM's with not one complaint. A player said that I shouldn't use it because a GM said something to them, way back so I stopped so I wouldn't hear any flack from some GM who was real adamant about it. I turn around yesterday and see a character using the same weapon.

what is too OP for some people, isn't OP for others. And we're here to have fun, not recreate real life. If that's what you're here for...Go outside.

Edit: Players said it was too epic, not GM's. To me at least.

[Piroska]

Two things!

First off, I'm going to remind people of the first of the many rules to which we agree to abide. Being respectful is a requirement. I know that sometimes discussions can get a little heated, but I'd like to reiterate this before this escalates. Thank you!

Secondly, from my understanding of the rules (which Aruen quoted), lore items are a no-no. If it has a specific name or a specific place within the Warcraft universe, it is extremely unlikely that players are able to wield these while in characters. In many cases, the item may not even be given to players, as specified with the Ashbringer example in the article.

The definition of what constitutes a lore item is a little less specific. For example, I have heard of a number of players who either currently wear or have worn in the past a Cursed Vision of Sargeras. There is potentially lore behind the concept of this item; when Sargeras essentially burned out Illidan Stormrage's eyes and gave him the ability to see magic, Lady Vashj gave him a bandanna to wear. However, in these situations an otherwise plain-looking item isn't (to my knowledge) being treated as an item of significance.

Regarding the concept of utilizing a weapon that was once wielded by royalty, I read once that nobility tended to hold a variety of weapons during the course of battle. This way, they could present these weapons to others as either gifts of appreciation or rewards for services rendered. They may not even have been used during the course of battle; the noble may have just held it for a period of time before switching to another. In the cases where items haven't been specifically attributed to a named character, it may be best to assume something similar to this.

I'd also like the add that this is just my understanding of the rules. A far more knowledgeable and experienced staff member can probably shed more light on the matter than I!

[enchantra]

I'd have to say, play it safe, if there is a epic weapon you want to get, but find it dodgy, when in doubt, give gms a shout.

Better safe then banned

[Harmonic]

Piroska rings true as always.

As for taking into regards our own polocies on this, people -cannot- request certain items.

I'll hopefully remember to elaborate later.

[Azheron]

I'd also like the add that this is just my understanding of the rules. A far more knowledgeable and experienced staff member can probably shed more light on the matter than I!

I would like to see someone who's more knowledgeable than you, Piroska. I'd worship him/her as a god of knowledge.

[Kretol]

what is too OP for some people, isn't OP for others.

This is a good statement. It can be a simple difference in opinion between GMs.

At any rate, regarding weapons like [item]50737[/item], that has the same model as most other axes from ICC. On the other hand, another weapon that was mentioned during this conversation, [item]Gorehowl[/item], has a mostly unique model (Warsong Howling Axe is similar, but note how they're both related - both orcish-originated).

There -can- be differing levels of 'lore' for weapons. The first axe (in my opinion) has nothing behind it other than what has previously been mentioned - Blizzard wanted something that sounded cool to drop from the last boss in the expansion, so those that wielded it could have a bit of inflation to their egos. On the other hand, Gorehowl has a lot more behind it - it's even seen in the hands of Grom in the ending orc cinematic. Check the Wowiki page for Gorehowl for more information.

In the end, it'll probably be at the discretion of GMs. And, if there are conflicting statements from GMs, then it'll be my duty to make the decision.

[Aruen]

Also this is supposed to be fun, some people like different types of RP. I like big ass swords, I think they look cool sue me. I don't like to be judged by people who sit in taverns all day on what -I- can't weild, because I actually enjoy my combat character. I understand we are aiming for a certain level of realism, and no offense as I know we aren't here to bash other servers. But the level of realism has been obtained. I've been to other servers and thats when you run into -real- mary sue characters, who are leaders of lore organizations dual wielding Frostmourne. Here some people just want a little flashy accent to their character because it suits their style of RP or it is visually appealing to them. Hating someone because of that is just you pointing out your difference in opinion.

Nobody here was judging anyone else, so that argument is rather null and void. Regardless, I myself find the realism on weapons and clothing a bigger item then others probably. It is not because I have extensive knowledge on how to use the things, but rather because I find they tear the realism apart. Nobody ever spoke a word about hating one another for it, the point of this thread was to get a clear answer on the subject at hand. Lore weapons.

what is too OP for some people, isn't OP for others. And we're here to have fun, not recreate real life. If that's what you're here for...Go outside.

Very true, but that's why I made the thread and opened the discussion. To reach some form of agreement on the subject, not to bash players or to kill the fun. Sure this isn't real life, but we are playing in a world where there is a established lore, and seeing CotH is a server that qualifies itself as lore following and high standards of RP, you can expect a person on here to follow it and attain a form of realism. I am not assaulting you personally, but I do think you could have put that a little bit nicer. I'm sorry if that comes over as offensive.

In the cases where items haven't been specifically attributed to a named character, it may be best to assume something similar to this.

That sounds reasonable, yes. But still, I stand by the point that people would have to write some degree of storyline on how they attained it. Call me a nag, but it's better then just stating that he or she found it. (Not that the person wielding the weapon from the original post claimed such a thing.)

Thank you for the input Piroska, I appreciate it!

I have always used the weapons just as models, and not being with the in-game lore.

Depending on the looks, I could see myself working with that logic. The blindfold of Sargeras rarely looks like anything special, or lore adding.

Thanks for your input guys, it's rarely said in discussion threads, but it should be said.

Edit:

In the end, it'll probably be at the discretion of GMs. And, if there are conflicting statements from GMs, then it'll be my duty to make the decision.

Very true, but seeing the conflict arrived over Barrenschat we felt the need of bringing it up. ^.^

[JVNemesis]

Piroska and ThePharoah have summed it up pretty nicely, I think.
One thing to add, though.
If you're just getting an item for the looks, and it's not an instantly recognizable weapon like the Ashbringer or Thunderfury, or something so ridiculously over the top with extra spikes everywhere, I don't see why you can't have it. It's not like people can inspect you IC, and notice that your blindfold is actually an epic item dropped by Illidan. Unless you run around shouting that you downed Illidan, that is.
I imagine the decision will rest with whatever GM you ask to give you the item, unless a list of no-no gear is added.
Seems like I've been beaten to the punch, though. Several times.

[Daginae]

Then just so I know before hand what's the stance on Dag potentially wielding [item]Royal Crest of Lordaeron[/item] and [item]Burnished Quel'Serrar[/item] as that's what I'm looking at for Daginae come Gruntship? I did ask Nexi about them earlier, and she didn't say anything against em, just want a second opinion.

[Aruen]

Piroska and ThePharoah have summed it up pretty nicely, I think.
One thing to add, though.
If you're just getting an item for the looks, and it's not an instantly recognizable weapon like the Ashbringer or Thunderfury, or something so ridiculously over the top with extra spikes everywhere, I don't see why you can't have it. It's not like people can inspect you IC, and notice that your blindfold is actually an epic item dropped by Illidan. Unless you run around shouting that you downed Illidan, that is.
I imagine the decision will rest with whatever GM you ask to give you the item, unless a list of no-no gear is added.
Seems like I've been beaten to the punch, though. Several times.

I've had the same problem admittedly, the thread got popular. *Laughs* I do believe the no-no gear set list is possibly a good idea to add. Then we perhaps get a vague idea of the boundaries on what can and cannot be wielded IC-wise in terms of looks and stories.

It can be quite a bit of work, but perhaps worthwhile. I can look into it at some points of the GMs appreciate it?

[OfficePearl]

So, if for the chance someone were to make character that were main characters, only to reenact certain scenes, would lore weapons be used then? I mean, the dude who has the ashbringer shouldn't like go around regular role-playing, that wouldn't make sense, but once again, what if for specific scenes that the community could watch as they are being acted out?

[Piroska]

If a lore figure were to appear in game for any specific reason, it would be appropriate for that individual to wield the weapons and armors that he would typically possess. This would be expected. Our concern is more that specific items shouldn't be in the hands of the players, such as the Ashbringer.

[AlianaS]

Then just so I know before hand what's the stance on Dag potentially wielding [item]Royal Crest of Lordaeron[/item] and [item]Burnished Quel'Serrar[/item] as that's what I'm looking at for Daginae come Gruntship? I did ask Nexi about them earlier, and she didn't say anything against em, just want a second opinion.

They should be fine, in my honest opinion. The only thing I see that could go wrong is if you are saying Quel'Serrar is the actual sword, since it actually has a lot of lore behind it. But I am just a player and GMs would as always have the last say. ^_^

[waffenbaum]

The best weapons are greys, since they tend to look like actual weapons.

And they can be traded between players if need be, without the eternal "I can't, it's super glued to my hand" argument.

No character is too cool for a good old grey.