Questions on Necromancy

[McKnighter]

Alright, I'm researching more into Necromancy, mostly OOC purposes so I know what I should be, or not be, doing in order to have one of my characters possibly become one. And I kinda just wanna know how Necromancers work just for knowledge.


Please post proof of your answer, like a link or book title, that way I can explore to make sure it's right, and there might be more stuff on there that I can read. :3


1. Should I be calling the Necromancer's magical powers Death Magic? Seem crude, but what they do is that "Necromancers twist arcane magic to manipulate the power of death." (wowwiki)


2. What causes... (Do explain in detail.) "In calling upon [Death Magic], necromancers risk being consumed by it — until eventually they join the ranks of the undead."

3. How does this go about? Just using Death Magic? ... "Commanding the undead, generally in the service of the Scourge, they gradually take on the characteristics of the dead — hollow eyes, shambling gaits, pallid and sunken skin, foul odors and so forth."

My character will not be apart of the Scourge, how serious will the effects been, and how long until they do start to appear?


4. This kinda goes along with Q:3, but is this possible in CotH? Having an uncorrupted Necromancer? (See link below)

http://www.wowpedia.org/Uncorrupted_Necromancer


5. "Sylvanas knew she needed necromancers to heal, strengthen and replace her people, and she set about wooing necromancers away from the Scourge, mainly by force."

a. Can Necromancers, powerful enough, actually 'fix' the undead into being alive again?

b. Can they halt the decay to a limp turtle's crawl?

c. How much can a Necromancer do for Undead, like could they make it so it's -almost- human?

6. Can Necromancers (In our CotH), become a Lich? Yes, I know, I just want to run around like a Skeleton and totally god-model, but I would like to know. I do believe Forsaken can become a Lich, In Tarren Mills, there's a quest about one trying to get Lichhood, but was stopped by humans.

... Just curious.

7. Would the GM's give said powers of the Prestige Class to a character once he/she earns them? Like, raising the dead, would be a skill to 'summon' a ghoul or whatever?



That's all I can think about now, feel free to answer one or them all. :3

[Karunzo]

1. "Necromancers are mortal practitioners of death magic" - http://www.wowpedia.org/Necromancy
I would say yes.

2. I reckon if you spend enough time learning/practicing a certain type of magic you shall begin to pick up traits from that school of magic, Warlocks can be corrupted by the nature of their fel magic, Paladin's eyes can glow brightly, therefore a practictioner of death magic, might eventually be consumed and become an undead themselves. (My own musings, though paladins' eyes are from http://www.wowpedia.org/Paladin, and the warlock's from, http://www.wowpedia.org/Fel_Magic)

3. I guess 2 has answer for that aswell.

4. This would take a very strong willed, patient character I think, not someone that wants to rush into the arts for the Power it brings, though I think it's possible you'd be safest with the answer from a GM.

5.

a. There is no current Cure for Undeath, though in the pre-WotLK event, the Argent priests could cure the state of an infected player, with divine magic. I doubt the same is possible with Death magic.

b. I did not understand the question, perhaps because I'm a non native speaker.

c. Mayhaps they could disguise it as a human, though you'd need to be a very powerfull necromancer to fully restore the decay of death, or to restore all the functions the dead body possesed, a level of power which I think, a player should not have.

6. "A lich is a powerful undead sorcerer who possesses tremendous magical power." http://www.wowpedia.org/Lich
once again, I doubt a player would be given this tremendous amount of power, but you'd best be of with a response from a GM.

[Piroska]

1. Should I be calling the Necromancer's magical powers Death Magic? Seem crude, but what they do is that "Necromancers twist arcane magic to manipulate the power of death."

You could, but I'd probably avoid it. The connotations of the phrase could confuse people. Furthermore, I don't think that it is a term inherent in the Warcraft universe.

2. What causes... (Do explain in detail.) "In calling upon [Death Magic], necromancers risk being consumed by it — until eventually they join the ranks of the undead."

The RPG states, "Commanding the undead, [...] they gradually take on the appearance and characteristics of the dead -- hollow eyes, shambling gaits, pallid and sunken skin, foul odors, and so forth." All I can think of is that arcane energy is a power that is corrupting; it ages the caster before his time. Manipulating death might be more potent or something. You don't need to know the why to roleplay it.

My character will not be apart of the Scourge, how serious will the effects been, and how long until they do start to appear?

The initial minor symptoms would probably appear early. The more severe ones would probably come with extended use and study. I'm partial to not dictating the speed at which it occurs, but I would strongly encouraged players to make sure to have these changes occur since it is a penalty incurred by utilizing this sort of magic.

4. This kinda goes along with Q:3, but is this possible in CotH? Having an uncorrupted Necromancer? (See link below)

They are extremely rare. Is it possible? Yes. Do I think that people should pursue it? Probably not, mostly because there is more potential to be gained from roleplaying someone who struggles with gradually becoming more evil rather than an individual who somehow and (honestly) unrealistically remains untainted.

a. Can Necromancers, powerful enough, actually 'fix' the undead into being alive again?

If by undead you mean being Forsaken, no. That's permanent.

b. Can they halt the decay to a limp turtle's crawl?

The decay is naturally slowed without aid. Necromancy can be used like a bandaid to fix damage, but it's can't reverse the state of undeath.

c. How much can a Necromancer do for Undead, like could they make it so it's -almost- human?

No. We've more or less adopted the concept that necromancers can only "repair" an individual enough so that he is nearly the same as he was when he became undead. Anything more would actually be reversing the process, which, unfortunately, can't be done.

6. Can Necromancers (In our CotH), become a Lich? Yes, I know, I just want to run around like a Skeleton and totally god-model, but I would like to know. I do believe Forsaken can become a Lich, In Tarren Mills, there's a quest about one trying to get Lichhood, but was stopped by humans.

Players cannot. Lich are universally members of the Scourge, from what I can recall; players cannot belong to this faction.

7. Would the GM's give said powers of the Prestige Class to a character once he/she earns them? Like, raising the dead, would be a skill to 'summon' a ghoul or whatever?

When players apply for a prestige class they are strongly encouraged to include a list of abilities that their characters will possess as a result of the training process. It's so strongly encouraged that applications have been denied in the past for not being detailed enough when this list is not included. We want to know what abilities a player will possess and how she will use them in combat -- particularly against other players.

Unfortunately, as has been noted many times before, we are not currently accepting prestige applications; we are conducting a review of the prestige system in the hopes of making it more effective and accessible.

[McKnighter]

Awesome.

Very good, my character won't be ready to apply for prestige anytime soon, so all is well.


Thanks for posting you two. This helps a lot.

[Aphetoros]

6. Can Necromancers (In our CotH), become a Lich? Yes, I know, I just want to run around like a Skeleton and totally god-model, but I would like to know. I do believe Forsaken can become a Lich, In Tarren Mills, there's a quest about one trying to get Lichhood, but was stopped by humans.

Players cannot. Lich are universally members of the Scourge, from what I can recall; players cannot belong to this faction.

Well here is something quite interesting. Not all Liches are a part of the scourge.

Rogue Liches

The rogue liches walk Kalimdor with no intention of raising an army as when they were under the command of the Legion. Even a single undead draws attention; putting together a large group will surely get the local populace upset. Instead, these liches harbor a single, driving goal; revenge. They seek out those who helped bring about their downfall, first destroying all that they held dear and then bringing ultimate retribution upon the target. [5]

Typically, the Lich King elevates only necromancers to lichdom, but rumors speak of the occasional mage or shaman who also attains this status. Some tales imply that a spellcaster with enough personal and magical strength can willingly turn himself into a lich, but these reports are unsubstantiated. Some powerful necromancers can temporarily transform themselves into a lich.

Interpret that as what you will, however I'm not sure if its saying that the Lich King makes these shaman liches or f they turn themselves into liches.

[McKnighter]

I also read that, but doing it on your own will, would take Archmage levels of mastery.

Hence, it could be a super prestige class, but I doubt we'll have something like that. If we allowed Liches, then people will question on others things, and the server slowly goes into a OP state. D:

[Nostra]

There are liches that are not part of the Scourge, the teacher in Acherus for an example or the quest for the Forsaken where you recruit a rogue lich for Undercity, however, liches are a bit too powerful and complicated to explain* as characters for us to allow anyone to play them.

[McKnighter]

I'm baacckk...

Necromantic magic has many functions beyond simply raising the dead. Masters of this tainted field of magic can conjure festering diseases, harness the shadows into bolts of incendiary energy, and chill the living with the power of death. Necromancy can also be used to reconstruct the flesh of undead creatures, allowing them to function again even after the foul monsters have been destroyed.

http://www.wowpedia.org/The_Schools_of_A ... Necromancy


So, does this mean a Necromancer could learn to use the Shadow, like a Shadow Priest would? Not to the same level, of course, simple conjured bolts, maybe attempts to pry into one's mind... No Shadowform or anything over the top. Eh? Meybe?

[Duraza]

Not to say I know...

But I would suppose you should take it exactly as they say. The mention shadow bolts so shadow bolts may be possible. They don't mention any form of mental 'prying' so I'm not sure that will end up falling into your range of powers...

Especially because a Necromancer is probably super focused mainly on his/her own death magic (raising your little skeleton army and such) so I wouldn't think they'd have a lot of time to delve into the mind control aspects of it shadow magic. Perhaps you'd be able to evoke fear 'chill the living with the power of death.'

I mean... it sounds like they -do- know shadow magic and so in all sense could learn how to pry into someone's mind... But a Necromancer is a specialized class that's going to spend a lot of time on mastery of Ice and Death magics if I'm correct. I don't know why a necromancer would take time away from his/her own work to learn/master control over someone's mind... And it would also raise the question of how good of a Necromancer you'll be if you're spending your time delving into other subjects.

But like I said in the beginning... Not to say I know.

[Beltharean]

Basically, there seem to be three different kinds of 'Shadow' magic, those being as follows:

Unholy Shadow such as a Death Knight's Death Coil.

Fel Shadow such as a Shadow Bolt.

Planar Shadow, such as a Priest's magic which comes from the Shadow Plane.

[ToxicFrozt]

This is a great thread, I will deffinately use this as a reference if I ever decide to go for a Necromancer in the future. I also think any one else thinking about rolling one should check this out.

[Grakor456]

Basically, there seem to be three different kinds of 'Shadow' magic, those being as follows:

Unholy Shadow such as a Death Knight's Death Coil.

Fel Shadow such as a Shadow Bolt.

Planar Shadow, such as a Priest's magic which comes from the Shadow Plane.

I don't believe these distinctions are every actually made anywhere, at least not by those names or definitions.

However, Necromancers wouldn't be able to use Priest magic because the two are wholly different in form and practice. Necromancy is a form of the Arcane, while the shadow magic used by Priests is "divine" and exerted through force of will rather than use of the Arcane. They're generally incompatible for this reason.

[Beltharean]

Well, the distinction is made by the form of corruption one receives through using the spell. The Death Knight's shadow spells would fall under being a Necromantic form of energy, in which case you would begin to receive arcane corruption of the Nercomantic variety. A warlock's shadow bolt would have fel corruption, while a shadow priest would have shadow corruption, that being loss of all emotion.

[McKnighter]

Basically, there seem to be three different kinds of 'Shadow' magic, those being as follows:

Unholy Shadow such as a Death Knight's Death Coil.

Fel Shadow such as a Shadow Bolt.

Planar Shadow, such as a Priest's magic which comes from the Shadow Plane.

I don't believe these distinctions are every actually made anywhere, at least not by those names or definitions.

However, Necromancers wouldn't be able to use Priest magic because the two are wholly different in form and practice. Necromancy is a form of the Arcane, while the shadow magic used by Priests is "divine" and exerted through force of will rather than use of the Arcane. They're generally incompatible for this reason.

Then what type of magic that involves shadow are we talking about? Spells like Death Coil would be considered the shadow bolts that the book was talking about, or is it something entirely different?

[Duraza]

I'm guessing they are different in the way that they corrupt you, as Beltharean said, and in extension, where you draw the power from.

Death Coil, as he mentioned gives arcane corruption. Therefore the source is arcane, as is the source for Necromancy.

Shadow Bolt for warlocks gives fel corruption, because the source of that shadow magic is fel.

Shadow Priests get shadow corruption, because they draw from the shadow plane directly. Also note that theirs is a 'Divine' power.

Really, a Necromancer is using Arcane and a Warlock is using fel. They aren't using direct 'Shadow' magic. However, the Shadow Plane permeates into all aspects of the universe and such so you get shadow magic from practicing Arcane or Fel as well.

My observations here may be wrong but I think your specific question about using 'mind control' type things has already been answered by Grakor:

However, Necromancers wouldn't be able to use Priest magic because the two are wholly different in form and practice. Necromancy is a form of the Arcane, while the shadow magic used by Priests is "divine" and exerted through force of will rather than use of the Arcane. They're generally incompatible for this reason.

If I were you, I'd take the fact that even though many things are labeled into the general category of 'Shadow Magic' play by the rule that just because you can use one form of Shadow Magic, doesn't mean you can use another form. Whether the book is grouping certain things together or not, separate them, possibly even purely on what classes in-game have what spells. Then assume if you're not that class you don't necessarily have that shadow spell.

Edit:

A simple example of this... Warlocks summoning Shadowfiends. I don't think anyone is going to attempt it because I wouldn't think a warlock would be capable of summoning a shadowfiend. Or.. Warlocks with Mind Control. The two don't really sound like they'd fit but the logic to get you there "That its all Shadow Magic" is quite the same.